Medication fight with Mom. Any suggestions? - AgingCare.com

Medication fight with Mom. Any suggestions?

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I wrote several months ago about letting a caregiver dispense Mom's medication. She has been kicking and crying ever since. She now has gone to another doctor who is not aware of what she is doing and he she says he has agreed to give her back her medication. I found all this out with a medical online site the doctors have provided. This doctor did call me and inquire about her medication and I gave him a short version of all that has gone on with her and that we had just refilled some of her medications. He agreed that when her refills are up that I, her daughter, could contact him and he would authorize a refill. He upped the dosage on her Sleeping medication and I picked that up tonight and gave to her caregiver. When I called her she said that he said she could all her medications back and now she was going to find a way to get them back. My question is, is it legal at this point to give her back her medication or do I keep suffering with all the Huh Ha and Crap that she is giving everyone. We decided that it was best to let a caregiver give her the medication because in the past years she has made many, many trips to the ER because of high blood pressure and many times stayed in the observation room for a day. Currently, she lives in a Senior Retirement Living Facility. I have mentioned to her that we are looking to place her in an Assisted Living Facility. She told me she was never moving to an Assisted Living Facility. Did I mention that she is 90 years old. Any suggestions?

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My Mom has been diagnosed with Heart failure, Memory loss, Anxiety, Kidney Failure due to high blood pressure and sleep disorder. There is not enough space or pages I can fill up with all the mismanagement of her meds, her attitude incidents during her lifetime. She takes about 10 different pills. The only thing keeping her going is a pace-maker and her medication. Please don't take me wrong in what I am doing. I am believing that her hospital stay 6 months ago resulted in affecting her brain because she has shown signs of dementia in the last 6 months. During that stay they took her to the emergency heart ward and ask me to give them the DNR code. They worked on her for several hours. Like all doctors they did not fully talk to me about what was going on.
She has refused to be taken to a doctor for an exam to determine her mental state. You can't make someone go if they are acting like a 5 year child. By the way her Caregiver is a certified nurse. I really think it is time that she be in an assisted living facility but there again how can a grown adult make another grown adult who is acting like a 5 year old child go on to where she can get the most help? Yesterday she told her Caregiver that she was not allowed in her room any longer. The Caregiver told her that she was hired to give her medication and she would continue doing so until she is told not to. My Mother told her that she just wouldn't take the medication then. The Caregiver told her that's OK because she would continue bringing her med as instructed and that she could do what she want with them and to just stay in her room and die if that is what she wants. We are all getting weary of her behavior and the Caregiver does not deserve this treatment. Several people mentioned Area of the Agency. I am sure they are part of Social Services but I will try to see what help/answers I can get from them.
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Reply to cmitchel
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Cmitchel, what strikes me is this.

You feel that your mother is not mentally capable of managing her own medications.
You are trying to reason with her to make her see that she needs help.

You see the contradiction, there? You are trying to use reason to gain the agreement of somebody you believe to be incapable of reason. Does Not Compute.

I don't want to make your heart sink, and I can hear the stress you're under coming out from my computer screen, but can we go back a bit?

Your mother wants to have control of her own medication. Patiently, listening before telling her why she's wrong: why is this important to her? How can we reassure her perhaps that she *will* be in charge, only with assistance?

What happens with her medication that wouldn't happen if she were doing it? Where are the rubs? What can we do to smooth those out?

The thing is, until your mother is officially acknowledged incompetent, and given how remarkably energetic and resourceful she is, there is nothing you can do to stop her rocketing around the town and enlisting the help of heaven knows what dubious practitioners. I think you might need to retrace steps, here, and see if you can't find a different route to gaining her co-operation.
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Reply to Countrymouse
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Is there any pain pills or tranquilizers among your mom’s pills? Looking back, my mom would hide her pain pills and then, about a week before a refill was due, she’d be out. She took more than was prescribed. Then she’d have a withdrawal. That’s when she went to AL because my dad couldn’t handle her. Crazy goings on in previously very sensible parents!
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Reply to HolidayEnd
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Camitchell
Thanks for coming back and explaining about the transportation. You have to admit, she is very busy on her own there. Finding and visiting a new doctor and going to a different pharmacy. She sounds very resourceful. I doubt seriously she would go to so much trouble for bp meds or thyroid tablets. I assume it’s something like Xanax or something else that takes away the anxiety instantly. She probably wouldn’t like the idea that she is addicted to a drug but it sure sounds like it.

As you have already learned there isn’t much you can do at this point. You were fortunate to find the new doctor and speak with him and to find out about the new pharmacy.

Have either of her doctors checked her for a UTI? That might be the reason for increased dementia like symptoms.

Where was your mom living before? I’m surprised she hasn’t gone back on her own.
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Reply to 97yroldmom
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Where is her caregiver when she's jumping in the senior van? If the caregiver isn't with her at those times, maybe you can change her hours.

I know when my Mom lived in the senior apartments, the Vans left a few set times a day, and that was it. If it's like that where Mom lives, try to adjust caregivers hours so she's with Mom at these times and Mom can't jump on the bus/ van.

Someone would have to be available to take her to Dr appointment's, or carer can go w/ her.

This is rough, I'm sure. Hang in there.
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Reply to Pepsee
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I am not sure where you are but in alot of places, a caregiver cannot dispense medications. That being said, could you just talk to the doctor and tell her that her insurance is requiring the bubble wrap pills the pharmacy can get set up? It seems it would just be easier.
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Reply to tacy022
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You could try telling her that she will not be able to continue living where she is if she insists on control of her medications. My mother has been in two different facilities and everything has to go through the staff. They confiscated a small bottle of hydrogen peroxide i provided for her to reduce wax build up in her ears. That is just an example.
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Reply to Riverdale
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Thanks for all your advice. However, my Mom lives in a seniors retirement home and takes their bus to the pharmacy and recently takes the bus to the new doctors that she thought would re-prescribe all her medication so that she could go pick them up at the pharmacy. She was not aware that we knew what she had done. Her former doctor that she has been seeing for 3 years suggested testing her for neurologist exam and my Mom said absolutely not and walked out on the appointment. Now, she refused to see that doctor and made appointment with a new doctor, again using the Retirement home bus. She tell me that she is going to get her drugs back one way or another. Today, I got a call from the apartment manager that she requested the bus driver take her to Walgreens which is a different pharmacy than where we get her medication. It is not my intention to give up taking care of her but trying to reason with her and why we hired the caregiver in the first place which is not what she wants . In my state you cannot make anyone take their medication. That is the law. So if I let her have control of the medication then I want need to get medication for myself to get through this with her. I am her only daughter as my sister lives out of the country. If something happens to her, it want be on my shoulders because right now she is making herself miserable as well as myself, husband and the people she lives around. Might I add her behavior has been going on for 6 months. I made my best effort to keep her safe from herself but she will have no part of it. I have warned her that if she continues having these episodes she just might not like the result. Last week she blamed me for putting her in rehab a few months ago when the hospital is the one who admitted her. I told her that the next event might just put her in a nursing home for the rest of her life.
So being a POA takes my right away to make decisions for her. She still has the say-so in any decision, right or wrong . We have looked into guardianship but this takes months to obtain and lots of paperwork. I have found that Social Service doesn't really get involved, as we have tried to work with them. They take your information but don't do anything with it. Does anyone have further advise?
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Reply to cmitchel
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Has your mom been deemed incompetent?
Do you have the legal authority to make changes for her? DPOA medical? Guardianship? Is she driving?
If she is incompetent and If you are responsible for her and no longer want that responsibility then you need to resign.
Call the Area Agency on Aging.
Let them know what you are doing. Perhaps the Elder Abuse folks would be willing to check on her.

If she is competent then you have no legal authority to interfere with what she wants to do.
I know you are worried. She is paying for a caretaker for some reason but if she is driving to various doctors and they are not deeming her incompetent, I’m not sure what you can do but just wait until she has an event that lands her in the ER for a reason that sends her to rehab. At that point you may be able to manage her meds more closely.
She’s not going to stop just because you say so.
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Reply to 97yroldmom
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Your mom says the doctor told her that she could manage her meds?

Can you confirm that the doctor actually told her that?

Send the doctor a written explanation of why you've asked a caregiver to manage mom's meds. Get a response from him in writing.

And when she ends up in the ER, don't show up. It's the only way that the hospital and her doctors will take notice of the fact that she needs a higher level of care. I'm sorry if that sounds harsh.
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Reply to BarbBrooklyn
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