If Medicaid is needed will they look back and see that a portion of my dad's savings went towards gambling and refuse to pay? - AgingCare.com

If Medicaid is needed will they look back and see that a portion of my dad's savings went towards gambling and refuse to pay?

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My dad is going to have to go into a nursing home.. we're working on that this week.


He will be a private pay since he has enough in monthly income along with his and mom's savings to pay for at least 4 years.


My question... if dad get's back to the point that he's healthy enough, he's going to want to go gambling at least once a week, if not more.


If he does this, and he lives another 3 - 4 years then he'll be out of savings and there will be a shortage for paying the nursing home. If Medicaid is needed will they look back and see that a portion of his savings went towards gambling outings and refuse to pay? We're not crazy about the gambling, but up to this point we've gone along with it because it was his money, he earned it, and as long as he paid my sis and brother in law for their care giving and his share of the bills, we felt he could do what he wants with his money. But the government might not feel the same three or four years down the road if he lasts that long and then his money is gone and he needs some help from them. I'm not sure we're going to get that through to him though...since he's thinking of today and not of three to four years down the road.

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The government does not set out limits on how a person can spend their money, be it wisely or not. If the money is spent to benefit (potentially, at least) the person doing the spending (or gambling, in this case), then it is not a gift and thus would not trigger any penalty periods when that person applies for Medicaid.
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I can agree with Windyridge about casino's who love the older crowd.

My sig other goes once a week to play poker just for the fun of it. It is entertainment for so many people. Sig other has gotten to know some of the people at his table and their back stories. Sadly there are people who don't have two nickles to rub together, and when their social security check arrives off to the casino they go hoping to strike it rich.

I came across this regarding Medicaid and gambling "Though rules vary by state, if you’ve divested yourself of a sizeable portion of your assets within the last five years, you may not be eligible for Medicaid. And the law doesn’t distinguish between gifts to relatives and gambling losses. Imagine an older adult who loses their savings and yet they can’t qualify for a Medicaid bed.” Thus I would suggest contact the State Medicaid office for their State ruling.
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Did your sister and brother-in-law have a caregiving agreement? If so, that's great! Not many think of taking care of that. If not, have them see an attorney to see what needs to be done.

As far as the gambling, since dad spent it, he should have some sort of records on his wins and losses. I would not be nearly as concerned with the gambling as I would the caregiving which Medicaid would consider a gift without a contract.
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Glad makes a good point about the cargiver contract. As for gambling, few people keep records of win/ loss amounts. In fact, most people lie about how much they lose. I don't know the Medicaid answer. Maybe others will chime in, but it sounds like the family needs to somehow get control of Dads funds before it all gets blown in the casino. Your Dad is exactly the type of patron they love to fleece.
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He has a gambling addiction, it must be squashed!
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In Michigan, gambling losses does not disqualify a person from Medicaid. Most people know how to get around paying taxes on W-2G income. I know my exes mother gambled away just shy of a million which came from retirement savings, cash advances on life insurance and credit cards and mortgages and lines of credit on the home and cottage. A bankruptcy court discharged $500,000 of the debt, the rest is mortgages or lines of credit on a home not worth that much. She qualified for Medicaid within a few months of the bankruptcy and she gets more help than the majority of people on here and still goes to the casino.
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Dept. Children N Famalies have an Authorized Represenative Form. This authorizes appointed or POA can self Authorize. Person as Represenative.
Represent Pt/Clent applying for benefits and using benefits on their behalf.
I suggest anyone caring for person have this paper. Authorization Represenative.Also authorizes use of Foodstamps etc.on their behalf.pGambling addiction. Alcohol etc. Soc Sec. will require a fuduciary payee. They do not recognize POA nor Healthcare Surrogacy.
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Dustein - I'm in New Orleans which has a dz + casino's within minutes to an hr's drive as there's pretty extensive selection of casino's on the MS coast. Plus we have the ponies too! If your state has legalized gaming, OTB, parimututal betting, there should be some sort of addiction resources available as percentage of profit from them has to go to fund addiction services for both the individual and their family. Seem to be underused service too. Really look into what's what for this for your state.

About the future possible issue of Medicaid & where the $ went possible penalty issues. IF you gamble, at some point you will "win" and if you do the casino's when they pay you will that you file some sort of financial info document. The casino will issue an IRS Form W-2G - it's for certain type of gambling winnings. Gaming is big biz and the big ones (PNG, Fertitta, etc) all do the IRS rules on $ and issue the W-2G's. Its taxable income. You really want to keep them as it will show that the tales of dad loosing large sums of $$$ playing the slots, ponies, etc has some validity. Comprende?

Also the casino's have all sorts of rewards programs. If he plays regular, he will have some sort of player card as that's how he does the buffet, builds points, get logo'd merch, etc. Make a copy of his cards (some are key chain tags) so that you have them to show that yes those $$$$ gambling losses could be valid.

If he still is pretty cognitive and competent, going to the casino's is still his choice. It may not be a good one but unless you have guardianship, it's up to him. Its really really hard to deal with the old roosters who are just determined to "date", gamble, have guns, etc.

You mention dad has maybe 3 or 4 years of $ before Medicaid? So dad has mid6 figures? 300K - 400K? Cause that's what he on his own will need to pay for a NH over 3 - 4 years. If so, that's a lot of $ to have and really he could benefit from seeing an elder law atty to make sure all his paperwork is in order. Is mom still alive? & if so she needs $ as well, Really for couples seeing an atty would be really worthwhile as the whole financial aspect of 1 in a NH and 1 still a Community spouse is quite complex for Medicaid and atop this you have gambling addition.
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My mom and aunt both love the casinos,, but we keep their money to a reasonable limit for them ( our limit is much less...LOL) We all have cards, but unless someone spending thousands a month you should be ok! They enjoy it and who am I to stop them if they are resonable. So I guess you have to decide what "resonable" is for your father?
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partsmom: They CAN recover though Reformers Unanimous. We are an addiction support group.
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