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My mom’s bank(and mine) will not accept my Mom’s POA for some reason. I really need to access a loan she has to work out payments. Thanks!!

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MomsOnlyChild, thanks for the update.  A consolidation loan puts the situation in a slightly different perspective.  

Following Barb's query, is it really necessary to payoff these other debts?  W/o asking for personal financial information (and I apologize if this was addressed elsewhere and I missed it), (a) are there sufficient funds to care for her now (b) are there funds for higher levels of future care?   

I think it's time to prioritize and decide whether these various loans really need to be paid off, especially if they're unsecured and not collateralized loans.    If the opposite and the loan is secured and reflected in title, what are the prospects of needing to sell the house/condo to fund her care?   (I apologize for asking basic questions but I became a bit confused trying to figure out the current living arrangement.)

The bottom line if understand the situation is whether or not payment of the loans is mandatory to reserve options for future care.   

Another aspect is a slightly alternate plan.   If this bank won't negotiate on loan consolidation, and you do deem it required to continued care for your mother, why not try another bank?
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Reply to GardenArtist
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Think about whether mom's credit score matters any longer. Let the loan default. You can't get blood from a stone.
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Reply to BarbBrooklyn
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When my parents updated their Power of Attorney years ago, the Elder Law Attorney placed their home address within the body of the POA, then that way, when one parent was left or neither could understand legal documents and needed to sell his/her home, I would be able to do so without any issues.

My parents POA was 11 pages long for each of them. Everything possible was mentioned in that legal document. Whew!

But as other had mentioned, some banks and investor groups rather use their own POA, which happened with my parents. It all was fairly simple.
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Reply to freqflyer
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I'm not an attorney, but I can tell you most banks want their own POA paperwork, not one done by your own lawyer.

I was able to work with my mom's bank and with her investment advisors at Charles Schwab, but both institutions insisted on their own paperwork being used. They took my POA, messed around with it for a couple of weeks, had me sign their papers, and all was good. I'm sure they ran a background check on me and who knows what else.

It just takes some time, but they'll take it once everything checks out on their end and you sign their stuff. Go back to the bank and ask them how to do it.
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Reply to MJ1929
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My spouse became trustee for his dad's revocable living trust when he became incapacitated, and adminstrator for his estate after death. He ran into a demand by one of the banks: they, of all the financial institutions spouse dealt with, demanded the ORIGINAL trust document to honor the trustee/adminstrator's instructions. Every other of the innumerable financial institutions, and the IRS/state department of revenue, accepted a copy of the trust or certified copies of documents. Spouse took this demand up the chain of command at the bank and was finally able to send them a copy only of the trust.

Naturally, spouse/trustee closed the account at that bank at the first possible moment, and moved the trust account to another bank that was more dedicated to cooperation and customer service. Suggest you do the same. It's hard enough to manage finances for an incapacitated elder or administer an estate. No need to indulge backward and uncooperative financial institutions. Get a session with the lawyer who drew up the documents or another estate planning attorney who may be able to straighten that out with one meeting.
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Reply to BBS2019
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I had a brokerage not accept my durable power of attorney. They wanted their own form. I had to hire a lawyer to raise holy hell with them. Ultimately I won, and then they had to pay the attorney fees
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Reply to marydys
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I recently did my own POA and asked that same question to my probate lawyer because I encountered problems with mom's POA with a bank. Bank reps do this to protect their clients but some managers are unaware of state laws. More and more banks do this. He (my lawyer) responded that contacting my lawyer will in turn contact the bank to set things right. Before knowing this little tidbit, I spent thousands to get full legal guardianship on mom. Can you contact the lawyer on the POA? It might cost a little. BTW, my lawyer practices in NC
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Reply to MACinCT
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Momsonlychild Nov 9, 2020
Thank you! I may have to contact an attorney here in Wilmington. My problem about doing a new one if needed is I can’t get mom to an Attorney office and she’s not competent to understand and I’m not sure she can sign her name 😢
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I have a letter of competency from her neurologist that diagnosed her dementia. It states her diagnosis and that she is unaware of the extent of her cognitive decline and that it is appropriate for the POA to be in effect.
It was necessary bc of a line in her health POA to determine when it was appropriate. I've attached it with her POA both Durable and Health.
I haven't had any issues so far with her banks and credit union. But it's a small town and most people had noticed the changes, and I had been with her to some of the places.
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Reply to Gracie61
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AnnReid Nov 9, 2020
Absolutely essential. I held a POA for my mom that was drafted in 2001, and it was never, not once, questioned or denied.

In the POA I hold now (there are 2 of us, functioning independently from each other) it was not honored in the bank where my LO had worked FOR HER WHOLE LIFE, and I had an assessment done on LO’s behalf by a reputable local geriatric psychiatrist, which resulted in a letter I keep with her paperwork and present wherever necessary.

Although (as most of us have learned by annoying experience) holding POA is NOT usable in managing an LO’s social security, it IS usable after being named an LO’s “designated payee”. I had LO’s SS check direct deposited to an account IN both of her PsOA AND HER NAME, and used FOR NOTHING BUT HER EXPENSES. Makes record keeping SO MUCH EASIER.
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When my stepdad was dying and Mum had POA a credit union was happy to accept it and a bank needed a stern letter from the lawyer who prepared the document. The bank wanted stepdad to come into the branch to confirm Mum as POA.

Strangely after he died the bank was far easier for Mum to deal with as Executrix than the credit union.

If your POA was prepared by a lawyer, ask the lawyer to contact the bank compliance department to find out what the issue is.

Side bar. I am Mum’s durable POA, there is no need for me to act in her behalf yet, but she is having me attend meetings with her financial planner and banker now. She is clear about who I am and that I will be participating in the meeting. Mum still makes all the final decisions. The POA document is not on file at either institution yet.
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Reply to Tothill
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There are no doubt several lawyers lurking on the site--but you probably need to bite the bullet and pay an attorney near you to clear things up.

My son is an attorney, and while he avoids 'family law' as much as possible--he wouldn't just 'take a look' at the legal issues of someone he can't visit with face to face.

I know my son does a lot of pro bono work, but he is pretty tough on the 'real stuff' as he sometimes has to go to court and his career rests on him being honest and transparent.

You CAN negotiate a lower fee, maybe? Our trust was so simple as I did 90% of the work, that our attorney felt bad charging us for 2 hours work. All he did was have it put it a lovely binder and have it notarized. He's since done a couple of small Q&A sessions--15 minutes a piece, to kind of make us whole.
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Reply to Midkid58
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I'm not in America but when I ran into a banking glitch with my mom's POA our lawyer told me "they are wrong, but they have more lawyers and can drag this out indefinitely". Your best bet is to jump through whatever ridiculous hoops the ask of you - I remember one poster who had to drag his clearly demented parent in to the bank to sign new documents, which they apparently had no problem accepting 🙄
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Reply to cwillie
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Oh, oh. And if I remember, Mom now has dementia, so cannot do another? What Lawyer did the POA with your Mom? He may review and advise even if he is out of town. I know my bro's banks were very picky on POA wording and I worry when others here suggest that a POA form be pulled off the internet or out of a book, and attempted. Often, later, when the elder has dementia this is too late to correct. A POA is specific in it's wording it it is good, and my own had items A through E listed carefully. Let me first ask if this is by any change a TRUST because a POA will not work for a Trust. You would have to be made Trustee of Trust with a Trust account; I ran into that on week one, so it was back to the Lawyer for us. That is how clueless I was in the beginning. I had to be made Trustee of Trust and POA for my bro. Luckily he was well enough to do this. In my case the bank would give me NO ANSWER to why the forms in my hand would not work; I imagine that is what you have run into. Try a BANK OFFICER at your bank and ask again, sitting at his desk, what is missing here. Meanwhile do not make ANY payments YOURSELF on your own with your money, or that may be further trouble, an assumption of debt or some other legal little niceity.
I am in no way qualified to look at someone else's POA with my small knowledge. I think the bank officer or another lawyer, or the initial lawyer are the way to go.
Mom'sOnly, I hope your appt with the care facility went well for you the other day?
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Reply to AlvaDeer
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Momsonlychild Nov 9, 2020
Very helpful! The Credit Union won’t tell me what’s “wrong” with the POA, how frustrating!
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They have the right to not accept a POA that is not specific to the institution. You need to make an appointment with your bank(s) and then you and your mom need to go in person with proper documentation and identification and meet with a branch representative.

Even if someone did take a look at the POA they cannot force the bank to accept it!
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Reply to NYDaughterInLaw
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Momsonlychild Nov 9, 2020
She’s not able to go nor can she sign her name.
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You need to find out the "some reason". Many banks accept NO POAs. They have their own forms that need to be filled out.
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Reply to BarbBrooklyn
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Momsonlychild, even with decades of legal experience I wouldn't volunteer to do this; there's too much liability. 

First, you'd need someone who is current on ALL laws and litigation that might affect the concept of powers of attorney.  That would be a practicing attorney in estate planning or elder law.  There used to be attorneys with active practices who offered comments periodically but I haven't seen any in quite some time.

Second, you would be gambling with someone totally unknown, and you'd likely need to establish some means of communication off board to respond to questions a competent attorney would raise.

Third, the "for some reason" as to nonacceptance doesn't make sense to me.   Banks have policies, but you have to ask them what the issue is.    Honestly, that alone raises questions to me as to whether or not the bank suspects something inappropriate in play.   That's not to question you, but if I were a banker, that's what I would wonder:  i.e.,  what is her REAL goal?

Fourth, what did the bank representative say needs to be done about the existing POA?  Are you dealing with a reputable bank?  If so, employees have standards that have to be met.   Find out what that standard is and determine if and/or how it can be met.

Fifth, perhaps the conditions (springing or otherwise) haven't been met and the bank questions your proposed actions.

Sixth:  possible issues:   the document wasn't executed properly, i.e., with the requisite number of witnesses and a jurat (acknowledgement) by your mother. 

Generally, if you're caring for her, I assume you have access to her documents, including the original mortgage, and presumably copies of monthly statements.    What else would you need?

In addition, if you're proposing an alteration of the payment schedule, you may have to go farther than just accessing loan data.   In the past, banks required restructuring agreements to modify terms, i.e., entire new agreements were executed.      I'm not current on what the good banks would require, and don't want to know what bad banks might do.

Lastly, mortgages ARE recorded in local Register of Deeds' offices, or similar recording department.   Why don't you get a copy of the Mortgage that way?   You'll need it anyway to restructure the loan.

Or is there something else that you want to do regarding the payments?
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Reply to GardenArtist
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Momsonlychild Nov 9, 2020
Thank you. It’s not a mortgage it’s a debt consolidation loan. I’m on all of mom’s accounts except that one. I’m trying to be up front and honest with them about her ability to pay the loan which she can’t.
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