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My 95 yo MIL with moderate dementia is more like a very very stubborn and precocious 3 yo. My husband is her only living family. The issue is that anything we try to do to make her life easier or safer is rejected. We tried a medical alert necklace. NOPE, not wearing. We tried a shower chair after she got stuck in the bath tub. She drug it out and will not use it. Asked if she prefered a walkin tub and other alternatives. NO. Got stuck in the bath a second time. Went back over why she needed to use it. NOPE. she said she doesn't want to use it. We tried to have her go to respite care while we were on vacation. She pretended she couldn 't hear us. We got her hearing aids as her hearing is awful. Will not wear and usually unplugs so they are dead.



She was a registered nurse and thinks she knows more than her doctor, so does not follow his advice. She is on aracept and takes on an irregular basis. I tried to set up a pill organizer and she would not.



She says her hair is a mess and has not been to the beauty shop for 3 or 4 years. I got her sewing scissors out once and she let me trim it. I have offered to take her to get it cut and she keeps refusing. I asked her when would you like me to take you to get your hair trimmed right after she comments what a fright it is. Don't want to go. I said, I will shampoo it and cut if for you. Where is your shampoo. She puts a ton of hairspray on it and it looks like it has not been washed in a long while.. NOPE.



We installed nanny cams in her house and she hasn't disabled them. It has been the only thing she has allowed us to do. She doesn't often hear the phone to answer it. She sometimes uses a walker after she fell and bruised her face right before going to see her doctor.



We had to steal her car keys and have the state yank her drivers license because she wanted to keep driving after having 2 black outs and being detained by the police as a confused driver. She was upset about that for 2 years. She has no memory of the blackouts, the ambulance, the week long rehab stay.



I cook meals for her and take her to the grocery store. I have to help her shop and find things. Also I put things in her cart for her so she will have enough to eat. She doesn't realize how much food to buy or maybe she is just hoping I will bring all her food to her? I live about 3 miles away. She refuses to go to assisted living and the arrangement we have now mostly works when she cooperates.



How do we get more cooperation from the world's most stubborn woman? She was very stubborn before which is one reason why her husband left her. He is now dead.

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The difference between a three-year-old and a dementia patient is that the three-year-old grows out of it.

You aren't going to get cooperation, so what is Plan B?
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NeedHelpWithMom Apr 2023
I was thinking the same thing. One cannot compare a person with dementia to a child.
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One thing I learned through my mother - and it took too long but boy I finally learned it - is that people who complain and are unhappy are going to be unhappy and complain NO MATTER WHAT. Unless some impossible scenario is enabled, usually meaning the complaining elder wants to live with one of their children and have that child take care of every single need all day every day.

I’ve tried to get my mom the best care possible and accepted that I’m going to get complained and guilted at . It still sucks but I know she’s in the least worst scenario, and I’ve carved out some freedom for myself at least.

Sounds like your MIL needs way more help and you need your life back! It’s hard but stick to your guns changing this care situation, and remind yourself that the complaining will happen regardless.

You can outstubborn the most stubborn elder for the bigger benefit. I had to ou-stubborn my mom, and this is a woman who got kicked out of a church! I know you can do this….hugs!
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Perhaps your DH has the right approach. He “simply expects not much cooperation”. You are trying things that don’t work – hair, clothes, safety etc. You want her to be sensible and look OK.

The other approach is to work out what you are prepared to do – perhaps just go shopping with her so that she has food in the house. Expect less, and wait for things to change. Talk it through with DH. If you have cut out things that he is concerned about, you might split the tasks differently. Perhaps not – you can’t make him do more, and his approach is working so far.

Stop worrying, check the cameras, and wait for her mind (?) or body to force anything that really needs to be forced. If an accident kills her, at 95 she has had a long life doing exactly what she wanted. Not bad!
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MargieRKB Apr 2023
That's the plan!
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Lots of good advice already given.

You say that your MIL will make "their lives unbearable" in a facility. They can handle it.

The bottom line is a three year old does not live alone. So why does your MIL live alone?

I agree with Need.
If I was your MIL's neighbor, and I knew the situation, I would be the neighbor that calls APS. It will be a lot better if you address the issue yourselves.

Your MIL should not be calling the shots, She can not make safe decisions.
And you are correct she will not be happy with you for putting her in a facility. But guess what ? Kids that don't want to go to school , still get sent to school.

It is a terrible situation, I know. I had a very stubborn and narcissistic mother that I had to put in Assisted living after she almost set the house on fire putting the wrong kind of lightbulb (and wrong wattage) in an old chandelier that could not take the newer kinds of bulbs.

My mother also had stopped all hygiene. She was throwing out the meals I brought her. She was living on cookies.

Soon you will need to place your MIL in a facility. Either when she ends up in the ER, Or you end up calling APS. Then sell her house to pay for her care. When that runs out Medicaid will pay.

It's also not fair to you or your husband. Your lives are being controlled by a 3 year old who is going on 2.
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NeedHelpWithMom Apr 2023
Way, Very well said!

Margie,

I certainly hope that you take advice from a person who has been in your shoes. Way2tired is sharing her experiences with this situation and her answer is very wise.
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You say “Putting her into a facility would probably make her give up on living and she would will herself to death”. You could be wrong – some posters have found (to their surprise) that a parent has taken like a duck to water to a facility, being waited on, and lots of activities.

You could also be right. At 95 would be it such a disaster?
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You say she was always stubborn, and that her husband left her because of it.
She is 95 years old. She has a diagnosis of dementia.
Given those facts I think it is unlikely she will change for the better.

I think you already know enough of dementia to know that the only help now is likely for moderating your own expectations. I surely do wish you the best but I think that MIL is unlikely to change a whole lot.
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MargieRKB Apr 2023
That is what my husband does. He simply expects not much cooperation. He doesn't care about her hair, or the same clothes worn for weeks, or whatever else she's stuck on. He just monitors the cameras to see if she needs help.
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well after the second time she got stuck in the tub I would have called the fire department to get her naked butt out. Maybe that would have been a wake up call? I could not have gotten my naked wet mom out of a tub, and she would have been humiliated to be seen that way! Save yourself and your back. Seems like she is able to use the walker if she doesn;t want to be seen by the Dr with bruises,, play on her vanity! Good luck with this,, and save yourself
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MargieRKB Apr 2023
I told her that was what was going to happen if there is a next time, but she won't remember that because in her mind it won't happen again. My husband helped get her out of the tub. She would not cooperate with me trying to get her out and I couldn't dead lift her. I am in good physical condition, but not super strong.
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My stubborn, narcissistic mother with dementia did better in AL than she did at home. She made friends. She sat by the front door and people watched who came and went. She gossiped. She convinced other residents to invite her in to show her how their rooms were decorated. She ate better. And yes she was angry for many months when I would visit. But the activities woman told me that my mother was doing that just to make me feel bad. She finally admitted to me that she needed to be there after the first year.

Your MIL may surprise you and thrive living on her anger. And not give you the satisfaction of giving up. But at 95 she may give up anyway when she can't do things for herself no matter where she lives.
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NeedHelpWithMom Apr 2023
Everything you are saying makes so much sense. Think about it. People who thrive on anger and just love complaining have many more people to complain to in a facility. They are getting the attention that they are seeking.

You’re also correct in saying that they know how to handle their personality. They are accustomed to dealing with various personalities.

So, I am sure that the staff takes everything they hear with a grain of salt. They get to know the family members and can see what is actually going on.

Plus, it won’t bother the staff as much because it isn’t their family member. They get to leave at the end of their shift and place work on the back burner.
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Yes, this is his mother he should be doing for her. You help him in areas she needs a woman but he does the rest.

You are dealing with a 3 yr old if she has Dementia. I so hope DH has POA. If so, read if its Immediate or do you need a doctor or two to claim she is incompetent to make informed decision. If Immediate you husband can place her in an AL now. Otherwise, he needs to get her evaluated by a Neurologist. This woman should not be left alone. It is no longer what she wants, but what she needs and that is 24/7 supervision.
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MargieRKB Apr 2023
yes we both have POA.
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She is never going to cooperate and the stubbornness cannot be helped now.
She cannot remain living alone anymore. This has to be the top priority now.
Your MIL should be in memory care or at least in AL. I am sorry to tell you but when the stubbornness reaching the asinine level there's really nothing the family can do except wait for something to happen.
A fall or a UTI or something. Then they can have the elder placed for their own health and safety. In other words it will have to get worse before it gets better.
If the state has deemed her incompetent and has taken her driver's license away, then there's documentation of her incompetency. Put in AL or memory care.
Have her son (your husband) step up and do what he needs to do. In the meantime, you can call APS yourself and tell them about her. That she is incompetent and lost her driver's license because of dementia and that she is not safe in her living situation. They will help get her placed.
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MargieRKB Apr 2023
She is doing decently well at home. Still uses the toilet, finds food if easily accessible and seems to enjoy living on her own. Would be a nightmare in a care facility and we are delaying that until absolutely needed. I am retired, so I have time.
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