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After whining CONSTANTLY on this forum and getting some nice "wake up" slaps in the face (thanks) I realize that it will be in my own personal best interest to reconsider placing Daddy in a AL facility WITHOUT the overnight care.

Quite honestly... I'm afraid (the words OWN PERSONAL interest alone make me cringe...am I being selfish?).

He HATED the last place. He just holed himself up in his room and would refuse to eat only to call have the front desk staff call me hours later because he was hungry.

He loves his overnight care giver, and putting him in the AL would mean that we would have to let her go.

I toyed with the idea of adding more in-home care (I realize that even the two weeknights and daytime Saturday and Sundays that I currently cover are TOO MUCH for me... terrible I know), but accommodating my needs would mean paying yet another caregiver which we would only be able to afford for about 2 years with his savings (that I promised I wouldn't touch... that would be where we would get the money for the additional care)

So... it's more economical for him to do Adult Day care and be in the AL in the evenings

I would also consider bringing back the Adult Day Center transportation service (which Daddy hated because the drivers didn't get him to the center when HE wanted to arrive...yet another task I took back on to make him happy)

The only thing is... he's going to go completely BANANAS about the change. He then calls his ex wives in tears complaining that I'm such a bad daughter which makes me feel AWFUL. I just don't want to disappoint anyone.

So... should I make him a part of the decision or just show up at the AL like "welcome to your new home!"?

Is there anything I can do to make this easier for him while soothing my old guilty conscience for breaking my promise to not put him away?

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Tiny, yes. In fact this may help you get started.

Some years ago the format was a lot more user friendly; the existing format is kind of tedious.
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In jail? Oh my. Now, you can't just say that and not tell us the whole story!
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I'm not offended at all. I appreciate the honest feedback. I'm assuming I can google a facility's Medicare rankings?

By the way... the no show in home care nurse finally surfaced. Apparently she couldn't show up for her shift or call because she was in jail...unbelievable
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Don't try it without an overnight caregiver.
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Tiny, call up one of his ex-wives, get her to go with you to find placement, hopefully near her if she is still in contact with youf father. You do need a little help.
Maybe the situation is not only confounding to us bystanders? Do you really need us to tell you what to do, step by step, to absolve you of guilt? You can say, all my friends agreed Dad should move in to a nice place to get the care he needs, wants, and demands.
We will be here for you after you have made the decision and taken that step.
Your issues won't be solved just by placing Dad.
Don't make me send someone , because sometimes, being nice is just not nice!
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Good insights, Ladee.
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I always have trouble with posts that ask about making things 'easier', or less stressful, or wanting to not feel guilty about something that has to be done... this is not a personal attack on you Tiny, this is just something that bothers me... life is hard, we all make tough choices all the time... and the guilt thing..... if you are waiting to not feel guilty, you will never make the moves necessary.... you work thru the guilt AFTER you do what needs to be done....

And this is a personal observation..... from what I have read, you probably have no idea what would make YOU happy..... as Cmag puts it, your dad is an emotional vampire.... he has sucked the life out of you and apparently many women along the way..... if he called you a CHAIR, would that make you one???? Of course not, same with being a bad daughter.....

Seems you need a lot of validation here for taking care of yourself, all the while not even knowing what that means or how to go about it..... and you won't know or learn until this man is placed where others can deal with him..... maybe you need to Google 'Stockholm syndrome', this is exactly what is going on here...

I hope I have not offended you or made you feel like a failure... because you are not a failure, you are still asking for help.....

Do what is right for you... but let me add, he is not going to say yes to being placed , keep that in mind when you 'include' him in the decision .... you are not punishing him by placing him, you are giving yourself your life back.....he has his own consequences to deal with, no matter what you do or how you do it...

I hope you get a taste of freedom soon.... or at least have the space and time to explore what that even means.....
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I would first research the Medicare rankings to eliminate any that might have nice websites and/or look good but have internal problems. Make a short list, then tour them yourself, or better yet, with a friend who can offer an unbiased opinion.

Make sure to create a checklist of what you want in a facility, and don't be hesitant to ask questions. It can help to go at mealtimes to get an idea of how many staff there, then and afterward, when there can be a rush to get the patients in the bathrooms.

I made a major mistake once of touring a facility on the weekend, since the push was on to get Dad out of the hospital and into rehab. I had a checklist but completely forgot to ask about patient/staff ratios. After the first day, it was apparent I had missed that critical factor; by the next day I was looking for another place and Dad was moved a day or so later.

After you find one or 2, then show your Dad. You don't want to accidentally tour a dump before finding out it is a dump and then be pushed back to square one again.

Babalou is right; he's not in a position to make a decision, but he can respond favorably to bright, cheery, well kept facilities with lots of staff.
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Can you tour 2 places and give him a choice? That's probably more than I would do in your shoes. Would you leave the choice of a preschool up to a 4 year old, or would you look at the online ratings by other parents, the state ratings, the educational qualifications of the staff, the proximity to you in case of emergency and the feel you got for the caring-ness of the place.. or would you be swayed by your 4 year old ' s attraction to the Ninja posters on the wall. It's the same thing.
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Well... the decision is getting a little easier.

The in home nurse that I was so afraid of "taking" from Daddy didn't show up for her shift last night so Daddy was left without medicine and dinner. To make matters worse, I prepaid her for the entire weekend so she took the money and ran...

This same no show was supposed to start transporting my father to the adult day center tomorrow, so I'm now left with the task of trying to find alternate arrangements or call in late (again) to get Daddy to the center.

The whole incident put Daddy in a tailspin, but it was just the push that we needed. We can't really have an "adult" conversation due to his condition, but I explained that a "nice place with people" would not make him "feel bad"

The next question is... should I at least try to make him a part of the decision by taking him along on tours or would it be better to just pick a place and say "you're going"
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Jeeze....I've not been through it with a parent and can't fathom the psychology involved.
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Wow............Seven marriages ? I'm just on my third and haven't beat any of them. Although I might give you a little slap. Just kidding. Sort of......I know how hard this must be but it is confounding to us bystanders to comprehend how you could be so guilt ridden about a man who had been so horrible. But hey....I've not been through it withna patent and can't fsthom the physiology involved.
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One more thing...if you think that having a relative in a facility is "putting them away", you're living in the dark ages. That phrase might have applied in some places 50 years ago. At least where I live, ALs and NHs are bright, cheerful places with movies, manicures and ice cream socials. Residents helping each other with their email and web-browsing, Residents attending in house church services and art workshops. And going on outings. Socialization is good for most folks.

Did you go to public school, or any school out of the home? Do you know that used to be looked at with disdain? But it's an efficient way of educating children, helps them become socialized and learn how to work with others. And it keeps many eyes on each child. I truly feel the same way about placement for the elderly.

You're not failing your father. You're doing what's in his best interest.
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Tiny, I've just skimmed through your other recent thread:

https://www.agingcare.com/discussions/caregiving-not-for-me-186219.htm

and can't help asking the same questions (and more) that Babalou has asked.

May I remind you of something you wrote in that thread that I thought was very revealing of your dilemma?

"I just want to live up to everyone's expectations and feel like throwing him away would be the ultimate let down for everyone. I was taught "FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION"

And in this thread:

"He then calls his ex wives in tears complaining that I'm such a bad daughter which makes me feel AWFUL. I just don't want to disappoint anyone."

Frankly, to quote and paraphrase the inimitable Rhett Butler, who gives a damn what he says to his ex-wives? He's only using them as a sounding board, just as he uses you.

"Is there anything I can do to make this easier for him while soothing my old guilty conscience for breaking my promise to not put him away? "

Okay, I do see progress here! There is a light at the end of the tunnel in that you're thinking of an alternate placement. GOOD FOR YOU! You're getting there, Girl.

Remember he's trained, manipulated and brainwashed you. You need to think of what's best for you. And part of that is also beneficial for him because it puts a stop to his long term manipulative behavior, which isn't healthy for him either. He may even have to face reality and stop back stabbing the person/people who are caring for him.

As to the manipulative tactic of not eating, let him go without meals a few times if that's the way he wants to behave. If he gets hungry enough, he'll eat. He's like a child throwing tantrums until he gets his way.

Do NOT worry about your "own personal interest". It's in his best interests to be in a place where he CAN'T manipulate people. Maybe it will help him grow up.

It might also be in the best interest of his ex-wives. I'll bet they get tired of his bitching.

(With apologies for the language I've used; sometimes these types of words are appropriate in situations which call for bluntness.)
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Remind me, Tiny. This is dad with 7 ex wives, all of whom he beat? And he abused you by making you care for him as a child? Can you remind me why you are worried if he's happy?

Look, I firmly believe that as adult children, our job is to help keep our parents safe, if they are no longer making responsible choices. Happy? Happy is a "good enough" facility, one that is clean, safe and has staff that does its job and cares for the clients. It does not tolerate shenanigans or abuse. Happiness is also something that most folks carry around inside them.

When was the last time you and dad were in the same room, you were both relaxed, sitting, just being with each other and you were BOTH happy?

Does it happen frequently, or is it usually that dad is only happy when someone else is stressed? Since I don't think dad will be happy anywhere, I don't really think ANY of the choices you make matter. Sorry to be blunt.

The facility calls YOU when he's hungry? I wouldn't entertain those calls at all. "Do whatever you think is best".
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