Follow
Share

My 85 yo mother lives in her own home w/o any debt. My dad, before he passed, asked me to oversee the money & property he was leaving to my mother & I was made executor of the estate. I am 58, married to a tv director & my father knew my husband as a businessman w/ access to accountants & money managers & my husband could assist me. For 14 years I have helped manage her investments and made sure the property taxes, income tax, etc. everything is paid on time.


In the last 18 mos my mother’s memory is declining. We tried to get her to a geriatrician to be evaluated in Feb & again in April, but she refused to go. She is fearful they will take her drivers license away. I have rescheduled for Dec.
My 1st brother moved in w/ my parents 15 years ago when dad was dying of lung cancer & Brother 1, 57, a veteran, remained in the house to help my mom as my father asked of him. Brother 1 has now been diagnosed w/ terminal pancreatic cancer & is rapidly going downhill & has asked for help w/ mom. She will leave food on the stove, iron on, leave the house w/o her purse or mask, forget what she set out to do, etc. Brother 2, 55, has come through a costly messy divorce, owes me $15000, owes my mom $15000 & owes 10’s of thousands of dollars in credit card debt. My mom told him he could sell his house & move in with her & Bro1, so Bro2 could get on his feet.


He has told both me & my mom the profit on his house sale will be used to pay back each of us the $15000. I believed Bro2 would pay me back until this past week when he told my sister (60), that Mom said she wanted him, Bro2, to be the FPOA and her MPOA. Mom told Bro2 there was $7000 “missing” from her Fidelity acct & she “believes” I gave it to my sister w/o asking. That’s why Mom wants Bro2 to be MPOA & FPOA. I have access to my mother’s investment & banking accts, but no one but my mother can transfer money out. The first time this “$7000 is missing” came to light in April, when my mom saw a $7000 payout on her Fidelity statement. Bro1 called me to say Mom thinks you gave sister $7000. Bro1 had mom call Fidelity & her money manager reassured her no money left her account by my hand, nor could that ever be done, only my mother has that power & the $7000 went to my mother’s AFFCU account. I also called my mother, denied moving her money, that I would never do that & had a 3-way call w/ Fidelity to again reassure her. That happened in April and now this “memory of missing money” is coming back.


My sister has been an ER nurse for 30 years & it has always been assumed she would be my mother’s MPOA. No documents have ever been signed (I was to fly in in April to take my mom to the geriatrician for evaluation & to get the FPOA & MPOA signed & notorized, but because of COVID, I did not travel & Bro1 could not get my mom to the doc appt for evaluation-she refused to go (fear of losing drvs license & what doc may say). I forwarded the docs to Bro2 thinking he could take mom to the notary so I could have the power to hire an at home health aide to be there to take the burden off terminally ill Bro1 to make sure my mom is cared for. Then I find out that Bro2 is stating that Mom told him she wanted him to be both MPOA & FPOA. My sister said there is something wrong here & believes Bro2 is trying to take advantage of Mom & the situation that Bro1 is terminally ill. When Bro1 was told about Bro2’s “power play” he said over my dead body. Bro1 is trying to get MPOA & FPOA with my name and my sister’s names on the docs before Brother 2 attempts to do it w/ his own name.
Any recommendations for what to say to Brother 2 who owes me $15000 & whom I have trusted to act with integrity? And what to do before my mother gives my heavily-in -debt brother the financial power to access to all the money she has in the world? My sister and I are prepared to do whatever it takes to continue to act in my mother’s best interest. Thank you all!
”LuLu”

Find Care & Housing
try and get to your mother asap get a lawyer asap don't wait my friend your brother is up to no good he want's to take your mom money and home hurry if you love your mom rush and do this
Helpful Answer (0)
Reply to misfairlady69
Report

Edit: contact an elder attorney.
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to Llamalover47
Report

You need to get a lawyer ASAP!!!!!! And show that you took care of your dad and was trusted with the finances. Brother #2 cant be trusted with anything. His finances are a train wreck, he owes everyone, trying to move in to mom's house. I believe to gain Aaccess to her belongings, and will never move out if house needs to be sold. Probably going to get his hands on her car, checkbook, valuables. Will try to get her to start signing things over to him.
He's already pitting each family member against each other. Is this a good person to manage finances? Heck no!! He can't manage his own..m Run to that lawyer. Get locks changed. He will be the downfall of your family. You will be stuck paying for mom.
How come he didnt help mom b4. But now he's broke he wants to be poa etc? Your mom will be hoodwinked and out in the streets.
Run to a lawyer now!

I would get a lawyer involved and from what it sounds like, you should be mom's financial advisor. You already proved to be competent and caring, and taking care of it all along. He could be trying to get her to sign over her house, bank accounts etc. Don't let him near her unless supervised at all times. That way he can't.
DO NOT LET BROTHER #2 move in. Mom will be paying for both brothers. Brother can't be trusted as far as he can be thrown. He will divide you all, and have mom a hysterical crying broke$$ mess. And you scrambling to pick up the pieces and probably paying for mom's care after the money has been stolen.

Im talking from experience. My sibling was moms poa/executor. Took 4yrs for simple estate to settle. Lawyer had to scream at her to complete it. Refused to tell me anything about finances/estate/belongings/property. I have a right to know and be kept up to date. Dont let anyone tell you otherwise. Told me it was none of my business and I had no right to know anything. Stole all valuables. I think took $. Told lawyer 3yr old car 36k under warrantee was junk. Let it rot for 8yrs. Took keys. Told me she was poa/Executor of dad estate/property. Left property sit 9yrs. I begged her to do something. Told her people all over that property. Didnt care. Said she had will. She will get to it when dam good and ready. Neighbors stole heavy equipt, mail, broke into house/barn mult times/stole. Dumped their recycles/trash. It became party house. Over >25k stolen. Went to court. Told 3 stories about 1 will, couldnt produce it. Lied under oath. I was being sued by nursing home non payment. Other no paid bills racking up. I won court case. I won a mess. Elec/phone/internet/insurance paid 9yrs for deceased people! House destroyed no heat. Kitchen floor caved in, due to water leak. Other floor absorbed moisture bc no heat/soil basement for yrs. Acted like a wick on the wood floor. Entire 1st floor destroyed. Roof leaks/about to fall in. Barn caving in. 2 Cars had recalls. Not taken to be fixed in time. Was told vehicle total loss. Other vehicles total loss bc rotting into ground. Never liquidated in 1st estate. So lied about that. So yea I know of what I speak. Run do not walk. He is not your friend.
Helpful Answer (3)
Reply to Jasmina
Report

From experience I can tell you watch bro2 like a hawk. My bro and I were co-ex for my mother after my dad passed. Our stories are parallel. Mom had dementia, bro owed everyone money with a bad divorce. Mom states money is missing, don't know where this coming from. Finally mom says I am unhappy I want to live with bro. Bro comes takes mom. Mom is gone and I no longer can have access to her. Months later mom is evicted from assisted living and living in SSI home. Then I get a call from her brother. Mom needs help. Year later Mom's investments are gone. $600K valued at one mil at maturity gone. Bro had mom change POA. Year later we are in court. Bro and wife charged with felony elder abuse. Bro/wife get 4 years in jail and I get mom back. Mom and her care are my responsibility. Court docs states bro/wife owe mom $326k (balance of early redemption of investments). Lawyer states if we need the money go to Civil Court. I am 69 still working husband is disabled. I worked 5 years past 69 to care for mom. The whole time she is angry with me asking for my brother. Good luck you need to be strong and stand up for yourself and take care of your mom
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to Pookie46
Report
Jasmina Nov 13, 2020
I am so sorry that happened to you. You are an angel for putting up with this!
(0)
Report
Imho, you should contact an ekder law attorney.
Helpful Answer (0)
Reply to Llamalover47
Report

Well I can tell you this ,both sister's that I thought I could trust truly stuck it to my father's estate 2 million then payed a crook lawyer to get them out of a peneltys with the state and the probate court judge. Stop it all before it's too late hire a real lawyer who knows the lay of the land.and fast. Good luck
Helpful Answer (0)
Reply to Panhead
Report

Check out DPOA. I had that for my husband. The long term care would give me no information until they saw my Durable POA. It takes affect immediately. Made my life more simple. W just POA you need Dr. saying not capable to make decisions. Check it out.
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to mlface
Report

The old saying is, loaning money to a relative is like throwing it out the window. Resign yourself to the fact you will never see it again. I had similar situation as you(not as many siblings) you need to find an estate lawyer who will advise you and your family members that 1. The money belongs to mom
2. All bills are to be sent to attorney/accountant who will pay debts and issue account statements monthly.
3. No one, including your mother has access to Fidelity account. As executor of estate you and attorney as cosigners have access to accounts.
Your mother's checking account should have no more than $1000 balance. Debit cards and credit cards should all be canceled and savings accounts transferred to Fidelity. Make sure that all cards ect are taken from your mom's billfold, leave drivers license. You and your sister sound like responsible adults, your brother, not so much. Money does strange things to people and it sounds like you and your family have become an ATM. Its difficult but you must say no and protect your mom. Talk to assisted living facilities, they can give you a lot of good advice about transitioning to a different living environment. If you are absolutely not wanting to move mom, you must get help for her and your brother. Bless your heart, this is a tough job because feelings can be hurt.
Helpful Answer (3)
Reply to Twithdogs
Report

Wow what interference ... my mom refuses to get formally diagnosed & now from reading your story now I know why.
So important for people to get everything in writing & notorized b4 the predators start abusing the sick
So sorry
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to mommynightmare
Report

As far as I can see, the only thing Bro 2 has actually *done* is report that mother told him (Bro 2) that she wanted him to be her MPOA and FPOA. And it is far from impossible that she would indeed have said that to him, and sounded quite convincing about it. Frail elders say all sorts of things to their children for all sorts of reasons, and if he's been having a hard time she might well have wanted to boost his morale and prove her confidence in him. It doesn't mean they should be acted on, and it doesn't either mean that Bro 2 can't be brought to understand so.

I should continue to trust Bro 2 to act with integrity, meanwhile carrying on as you were with the process to set up her previous, more formally agreed decisions on her powers of attorney. Has Bro 2 declared any opposition to that? Have you talked to him directly about it?
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to Countrymouse
Report
FloridaDD Nov 12, 2020
I would be very careful given that Bro 2 owes money all over town.   I would not be calling the police on him, but I would not let him handle any money, or borrow more
(2)
Report
Ignore those who are saying back off and let the chips fall where they may! The potential for mom to lose everything and be destitute is too great.

Great to hear that Bro #1 and Sis were able to reason with mom and get the documents signed. Bro #2 could still attempt to "redo" those documents, so it would be good to review everything with a good Elder Law atty. IF he ever tries this, he could use her diminished capacity to argue the case. IF he tries this, the best way to deal with it is to seek guardianship and conservatorship. Those override any and all POAs and MPOAs. People like Bro #2 can be real jerks and make life miserable, but the focus should be on protecting and getting care for both mom and Bro #1.

I doubt he has enough assets to proceed with this, but you never know! Clearly a judge should not grant him guardianship - he can't manage his own finances or life, so he shouldn't be trusted to care for her and her assets.

As for what he owes you and your mother, I wouldn't hold my breath. You'll likely never see those loans paid back. Lesson learned: no more assistance for him, at least not financially.

Hoping for the best for Bro #1. Despite his own serious issues, clearly he has mom's best interest at heart! Although often hospice is considered the end, it isn't always. Explore what help he and mom might qualify for. If with POA you can "manage" her finances, hire help using those funds to care for her.

Regards to you, your mother, Bro #1 and Sis. Bro #2 can go find a rock to crawl under!
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to disgustedtoo
Report

Yes, as others have stated, hire an estate-planning or/and elder-care attorney. Most give one free consult and an estimate of cost.

I work with elder-care attorneys and estate-planning attorneys, and they have frequently told me that the person most likely to rip of an elder is an adult son, and most often, the youngest adult son.

Run don't walk to an attorney. It is fairly easy to dupe an elder with declining mental faculties.
Helpful Answer (3)
Reply to Heather10
Report
NeedHelpWithMom Nov 12, 2020
I can believe this. The youngest is usually spoiled! Some moms baby their youngest child.

Thanks for sharing this info.
(2)
Report
Through all what is guaranteed to be a financial, nuclear meltdown, you have one clear choice. Get an estate attorney, yesterday! However you have to do it, get your mother's mental clarity evaluated. Present all information on brother #2, divorce debt, unpaid loans, etc. to lawyer. Find out if $7000 actually came out of her Fidelity account.
"Brotherly love" evaporates when financial distress exists, and opportunity presents. Your brother is the addict and your mentally failing mom's estate the drug. Unless you are prepared to assume care for her, and its immense expense, get a lawyer in to protect her assets for future need and your legal authority on paper. Brother #1 can give a notarized statement of your mom's original wishes.
With brother #2 living there, you have no control of the influence he is exerting over your mom. If you can't get him out, bring the lawyer in before he does!
Helpful Answer (2)
Reply to SouthernSun
Report

I recommend a very good elder care attorney to resolve this. Bro 2 has conflict of interest and will take advantage of everything. Mom needs to be evaluated ASAP.Bro 1 needs to have peace during his last months. Mom needs to have home care or placed in AL.

I had a similar situation. Relatives did take advantage of Mom and then tried to put her out before I could intervene. I now have full guardianship and fiduciary powers. My siblings grew up fast to resolve their own problems without Mom's money. They also cut all communication with me and Mom which is fine. Their loss !
Helpful Answer (2)
Reply to Cecimerce
Report

This is too complicated a situation to be addressed in this forum, too much he said she said.

The short answer is step away and let chips fall where they may. Unfortunately you can only do so much to enable people to resist consequences of their decisions. Sad, but it is what it is and you’ve done your part.
Helpful Answer (3)
Reply to LakeErie
Report

I would say just step out of it. You have brothers that are willing to step up and help her and there may be no disuading her in her belief you took the money. So just let the cards fall where they may. You can only control so much.
Helpful Answer (2)
Reply to sneeze1234
Report

Without POAs, mom is still the one in control of medical and financial decisions and apparently is being manipulated by brother 2. Seems you need to go in December and make mom go for a "check up" that will probably declare her mentally incompetent. Before her appointment, get that family lawyer appointment to get the POAs written. I am concerned that she will give brother 2 both POAs and that is a risk you will have to take. She will NOT be deemed competent to assign POAs after a "mentally incompetent" diagnosis. Another option is to take the time and money to be declared her guardian which will give you power of both POAs. The courts will side with you since you have already been doing the job, have family members that will vouch for you and are already her executor.
Helpful Answer (0)
Reply to Taarna
Report

Whoever is power of attorney should also assume all the care. The cost of care is not cheap. If she ends up having to go to a nursing home, there is a 5 year look-back law and gifting will be penalized. The nursing home will take all her assets..now they cannot take her house (if her name is the only person on the title) until she dies. Anything that goes to probate Medicaid can potentially seize due to the Federal estate recovery law.

Estate planning is essential to avoid probate. That requires an eldercare attorney, and you will need POA..which is another complication if that is not set up.

If your mom is not competent it is too late to get her to appoint someone, so will need the Court system to appoint a legal guardian. That's another attorney. Good luck.

Luckily it sounds like your husband has good money so you can afford all of these attorneys.
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to cetude
Report

If your mother has not made you POA for her medical and financial affairs, have this done immediately. And she should have a living will that states her wishes for medical care. You may have to take some time off to spend a week with her to take care of this. Get an attorney. Banks also may have their own POA forms. Do this immediately while she is still capable of signing forms. POA is needed for you to take over her financial affairs during her lifetime. Once you have the POA, you can ask for all bills and statements to be sent to your address so that you can monitor what's happening with her accounts. If you don't trust your brother, it's probably best for him not to see the statements. If there will be aides in the house, it's also best to have statements sent to you.
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to NYCdaughter
Report

Get a lawyer immediately. Get a POA and put yourself on everything. Cancel the credit cards. Inform the banks and mortgage lender. My brother changed the Title of the home and siphoned off all the retirement investments, social security, tax refunds, rented out the home, defrauded they city for Homestead status, filed false tax returns for both himself and my parents. After the fact no one cares or will help and lawyers fees are outrageous to context.
Helpful Answer (0)
Reply to Horrified
Report

I am so happy to hear that your mom listened to reason and that things are lined up in her best interests. At least brother 2 will not be able to take advantage of mom. Continued prayers for your family as your brother fights his battle with pancreatic cancer.
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to Takincare
Report

I have fantastic news. Brother 1, who is terminally ill, and my nephew (38) my sister’s oldest son, sat my mom down & told her that the MPOA & FPOA are there to protect & care for her while she is alive & the two people w/ the most financial & medical experience are myself & my sister, not my Brother 2 that owes 10’s of thousands of dollars. They both told my mother they promised our father to take care of her and this would be keeping their promise to our dad. She agreed and she let them take her to the notary and she signed the MPOA & FPOA naming myself and my sister, the nurse, 1 & 2 On the docs. What a relief!
Now to help my Brother 1 get the help at the house he needs to relieve him of the pressures of overseeing & caring for my mom 24/7, while he can focus on getting the medical care for his pancreatic cancer. Praying for his relief. Thank you all.
Helpful Answer (17)
Reply to Rollin5
Report
FloridaDD Nov 11, 2020
This is great news!!!!  Really glad it is starting to work out.
(2)
Report
See 1 more reply
Oh my gosh, this is a nightmare. I don’t know what to say other than I wish you all the best. Good luck in finding a solution to this messy situation.
Helpful Answer (1)
Reply to NeedHelpWithMom
Report

I believe you know that being executor of estate doesn't mean anything. It is the Financial POA who is charge of the finances IF your Mom is diagnosed with dementia, and at the point that she is judged incompetent whomever is FPOA is in charge of finances and that cannot be changed.
There are a lot of characters at play here with Mom, you, and two bros. I think that you will need both mediation and a GOOD Attorney, and you should likely get this before finalizing any testing that could deem your Mom unable to assign a POA. She need not be perfect, but she does need, in the examining Lawyer's assessment, to be able to understand what she is doing. It is my feeling all family members should be present. You have a brother here who is caring for his Mom, and he is quite ill. The future needs to be carefully and PROFESSIONALLY assessed and worked out for all best as possible. Geaton posted the following some time ago for Forum, and I use and thank Geaton for it every time:
Mediate.com
APFMnet.org (Academy of Professional Family Mediators
ACRNet.org (Assn. for Conflict Resolution
Wishing you good luck. Hope you will update and post to us any success you have. It sounds all quite complicated.
Helpful Answer (5)
Reply to AlvaDeer
Report
Rollin5 Nov 8, 2020
Thank you so much. Your response is very helpful.
(2)
Report
Ask a Question
Subscribe to
Our Newsletter