Here my take on gifting & having it become a clusterF for Medicaid: - what is their probability on death? Look at insurance co actuarial tables to see where the elder is for death probability. & - how much liquid & easily available $ does is elder have? Not the supposed value of their home but $ in the bank or in investments they can cash out within a few days.
Costs of care are HUGE. HUGE!. Folks tend to way way underestimate costs and are not understanding the limits of coverage their health insurance has. & then are gobsmacked that MeMaws $ 123,456.78 in savings is maybe, like hopefully maybe, payment for 8 months in a skilled nursing care facility aka a NH as it’s all private pay as Medicare does not at all pay for custodial care. This elder, MeMaw, has no-zero-nada of $ to be able to gift. Memaws gonna need every penny to spend down in private paying for her NH, then filing for LTC Medicaid once she’s done her spend down (usually it a max of $2,000.00 allowed as exempt asset).
Why? Average stay in a NH 2.5 yrs & avg cost 8-10K a mo. So if elders over $350,000.00, she has plenty of $$$$ to gift and still have big enough of a wallet to afford private pay. & likely to die b4 she runs out of $.
But under 300Large, personally I wouldn’t risk it. It’s really easy for the elderly to outlive their money as it’s nothing but outflow for costs of living even b4 a NH especially cost of maintaining likely older property (homes & cars). Most elderly get the avg Social Security $1,200 and most still have health care & RX copays. If your elder’s only source of income is only SS, it’s not enough $. She will need to draw down from her savings to pay for regular costs of living.
Whatever the $ is, imo, this is not ever something to be done as a DIY. Find a CELA level of elder law attorney and have your elder go over legit options. Elder pays for this from their $.. Money moves have IRS filing and tax consequences…. you don’t want to have her get caught out with the IRS.
The 5 yr lookback is really. & can be quite intense. There is someone on this forum who isPOA for her hubs Auntie. & she had to be able to show the legit spend on checks made out to individuals for over $200! '
If on Medicaid, absolutely do not do anything. If the elder is competent and has assets like stocks and IRAs, they can fill the form for beneficieries. Just make sure there is $$$ available for funerals and executor to pay off bills when beneficieries are done. It avoids most probate. Checking accounts can either have a joint owner. A house will usually need a will. If it goes to probate then the state has rules of distribution if no will. Gifting is somewhere up to 15 K. Then she or her executor will need to include it in the last taxes. Ideally if there is a substancial amount of money available, it may be best to consult a probate lawyer before health issues get too far along.
She should ask this question of medicaid if she is thinking she may need to apply, and to be frank, if he hasn't money enough to both care for himself into the future AND give gifts, then he must keep the money he has for his own care. He certainly can slip a 50.00 bill into the Christmas stocking; no one will question that, but at the point that he is giving sums in the 1,000s, they WILL most definitely . And they should. If you want hard and fast answers go to the source, but do know that rules and laws can change. This elder should hang on tight to his money and get the best rates he can right now. Just my opinion.
Each state has its own look-back period. Most states are 5 years. And each state may have its own ceiling of "gifting". You don't say how old this parent is or what state they reside in, so getting advice here is NOT a good idea. We aren't lawyers or accountants or Medicaid experts. The safest thing would be for this parent to go to a certified elder law attorney and create a trust. That's what we've done for ourselves and our children.
Is she talking about Medicaid regulations in her state or IRS regulations? Many people confuse the two.
Is she anticipating that she will need Medicaid to pay for her end-of-life long term care? Does she understand the difference between Medicaid and Medicare?
She should talk to an elder care attorney if she has significant assets/income.
- what is their probability on death? Look at insurance co actuarial tables to see where the elder is for death probability.
&
- how much liquid & easily available $ does is elder have? Not the supposed value of their home but $ in the bank or in investments they can cash out within a few days.
Costs of care are HUGE. HUGE!. Folks tend to way way underestimate costs and are not understanding the limits of coverage their health insurance has. & then are gobsmacked that MeMaws $ 123,456.78 in savings is maybe, like hopefully maybe, payment for 8 months in a skilled nursing care facility aka a NH as it’s all private pay as Medicare does not at all pay for custodial care. This elder, MeMaw, has no-zero-nada of $ to be able to gift. Memaws gonna need every penny to spend down in private paying for her NH, then filing for LTC Medicaid once she’s done her spend down (usually it a max of $2,000.00 allowed as exempt asset).
Why? Average stay in a NH 2.5 yrs & avg cost 8-10K a mo.
So if elders over $350,000.00, she has plenty of $$$$ to gift and still have big enough of a wallet to afford private pay. & likely to die b4 she runs out of $.
But under 300Large, personally I wouldn’t risk it. It’s really easy for the elderly to outlive their money as it’s nothing but outflow for costs of living even b4 a NH especially cost of maintaining likely older property (homes & cars). Most elderly get the avg Social Security $1,200 and most still have health care & RX copays. If your elder’s only source of income is only SS, it’s not enough $. She will need to draw down from her savings to pay for regular costs of living.
Whatever the $ is, imo, this is not ever something to be done as a DIY.
Find a CELA level of elder law attorney and have your elder go over legit options. Elder pays for this from their $.. Money moves have IRS filing and tax consequences…. you don’t want to have her get caught out with the IRS.
The 5 yr lookback is really. & can be quite intense. There is someone on this forum who isPOA for her hubs Auntie. & she had to be able to show the legit spend on checks made out to individuals for over $200! '
If the elder is competent and has assets like stocks and IRAs, they can fill the form for beneficieries. Just make sure there is $$$ available for funerals and executor to pay off bills when beneficieries are done. It avoids most probate. Checking accounts can either have a joint owner. A house will usually need a will. If it goes to probate then the state has rules of distribution if no will. Gifting is somewhere up to 15 K. Then she or her executor will need to include it in the last taxes.
Ideally if there is a substancial amount of money available, it may be best to consult a probate lawyer before health issues get too far along.
Is she anticipating that she will need Medicaid to pay for her end-of-life long term care? Does she understand the difference between Medicaid and Medicare?
She should talk to an elder care attorney if she has significant assets/income.