Father just made his bar buddy his POA. A few facility employees keep insisting I speak with my dad's POA that isn't even in effect.
Mom is on hospice. She has Alzheimer's, but was just diagnosed with cancer.
It's not a medical POA. Father retains his autonomy right now. My mom has cancer and dementia. Dad is so mean he spits nails. The nurse practitioner sent me a text about how he spoke with my dad's friend and how he's on board regarding mom's pain relief. He said if I'd like his number he'd share it with me.
My response was "No thank you! If he's medical POA (dad said he is not), you guys should have a copy of that form. If he's relaying my dad's wishes, that's something different. I'm not involved with the buddy...that's my dad's thing. I barely know him. But I agree with the Dr that pain relief is the goal. 😊"
My dad said it's a POA for the grandkids inheritance only. 🙄
My dad recently said he deals with his buddy because he does what he says without arguing. He's punishing me because I didn't bow down and do everything he told me to. I created boundaries. He's verbally and emotionally abusive. A narcissist.
When I called my dad yesterday to discuss my mom he made believe there was nothing to talk about. When I mentioned mom's cancer he told me he didn't want to talk and said, "byeeee byeeee." Like a dismissive na na na na na na.
Anyway, should I reach out to the director? It's bad enough I'm dealing with mom's death. It's a punch in the gut every time they suggest I talk to a non family member whom I barely know.
Each State is different but I think with POAs they are pretty much the same. This is what I have been told concerning POA and my experience. You may want to see a lawyer to see if its like this in your State.
You father has no power to assign POA to someone for your Mom. Only Mom can assign a POA and she is incompetent to do so. Even if Dad had POA for Mom, he cannot transfer that POA to someone else unless your Mom named a secondary. In that instance, Dad could revoke his POA for Mom and allow the secondary to take over. Or he dies before Mom and the secondary takes over.
Doctors can put a POA in effect by declaring a person incompetent to make informed decisions. Its written in the Springing POA document. The POA does not need to go to court for a Judge to make a judgement. With Guardian/Conservatorship it does need to go to court and a Judge uses doctors recommendations to make a decision.
I doubt if the beer buddy would go to court to get conservatorship. Its expensive and no guarantee he will get it and I doubt if Dad will give buddy the money. You as Moms daughter could protest it. You are Moms closest kin, not Dad. Other than being married to Mom, he is not a blood relative.
I have the impression that beer buddy getting POA is recent. As u replied to me, Mom was diagnosed years ago with Dementia. In early stages if they can understand what they are signing, a lawyer may go ahead with a POA. But seems your Mom is pasted being able to assign anyone.
I agree that all you need to do is what you did. The buddy has nothing to do with Moms care. He can be there to make sure Dad understands what is going on with Mom but he cannot make decisions on Moms care, IMO. Tell the NP she/he is not to give any info to the buddy directly concerning Moms care. If Dad tells him nothing u can do. Him holding POA for Dad gives him no authority over Mom. POAs are individual.
I think you have already told the NP this man has no authority concerning your Mom. That should be it. The NP suggested it, thats where he/she stops. Now you ignore NP. Hospice is actually now in charge of Moms care not the NP. The Hospice has a Dr who oversees the Nurses. He orders any medication Mom needs and discontinues any he feels is not needed. The Nurses can give no medication that is not ordered by the Hospice Dr. You can ask the Hospice Nurse if I am right. Mom will be given morphine for the pain and ease of breathing. If she has anxiety, the nurses will get an order for that.
Now you tell Dad, the POA and the NP that your Mom is in the hands of Hospice. That your time will be with her and spent on her. That they will no longer be involved with her care. Thats what Hospice is there for. That the POAs responsibility is Dad and only Dad. That Mom is going to have a peaceful death. Soooo, they all are to leave you alone so u can spend uninterrupted time with Mom.
When she passes, I would report the NP. He/she is too full of themselves. He/she IMO has stepped over the line. I would also allow the POA to take over Dads care and walk away.
Hospice is giving her a fentanyl patch for pain. It was just upped.
Your mom has just been diagnosed with cancer, yet you're dealing with your mom's death? What am I missing here?
If buddy tries to get guardianship over your Mom and succeeds, then you're in trouble. Guardianship would mean he would have control over everything regarding your Mom: her finances, the health decisions, even who she can have contact with/not...
Also:
a diagnosis of dementia (your Mom) doesn't automatically mean she can't sign POA. You might not be aware of that.
ONLY a court can declare someone mentally incompetent. NOT a doctor. There are various levels of dementia. If the person still seems logical, still knows certain essential facts, then she can still be deemed mentally competent and CAN sign POA. A lawyer would allow it, if when speaking to her, she appears mentally competent.
IF THAT'S THE CASE,
then you can't be 100% sure buddy doesn't already have POA over your Mom.
Then maybe really, the facility is talking about buddy's POA over your Mom...
If that's what happened, I suggest you get your Mom to revoke that POA right away, and make you POA. It's easy to revoke, cancel, a POA.
I would never assume to insert myself into anyone else's family. It's such a shame.
Fingers crossed I don't have to deal much longer. I say that with compassion in my heart, because my mom is in so much pain.
I live by the saying not my circus, not my monkeys. I wish others would do so as well.
Dad's buddy cannot make medical decisions for my mom. This is why I'm questioning whether or not to contact the AL to inform their employees to stop suggesting I speak with dad's buddy. He cannot tell me anything different from the facility.
Burnt has a good point considering the facility going for guardianship. Notgoodenough has a point too. Just call him and get it over with. Then u can tell the NP that you called and now u have done that...you are only going to worry about Mom. Any problems they have with Dad is between them, Dad and his POA. You no longer hold POA for Dad.
My dad online banks, I can guarantee it's set up for automatic withdrawal. Neither here nor there.
Dad's buddy can't have POA for mom, she got diagnosed years ago. She couldn't have signed anything for him.
I get calls informing me of my mom condition. Her condition is all I care about.
I just don't know why NP is throwing it out there to discuss mom condition with him. NP literally said he knows nothing about POAs, just that dad's buddy said he's dad's POA.
NP isn't forcing me to call...he just throws it occasionally into text messages and ticks me off lol
I certainly am sorry for all you are experiencing with your father. Perhaps if your focus could be on your mother in whatever capacity that entails you could free yourself somewhat from all the negativity.
As I said, speaking with him doesn't obligate you to anything. And rather than wonder endlessly what this is about and worry endlessly about your mom's care you might get some answers and at least put your mind at ease about mom.
Maybe I'll just ignore it 🤣. Just pay attention to mom. Dad and buddy can do whatever they want. Ignorance is bliss.
Are the grandkids who will get an inheritance your children? Must be, as you are an only child, correct? You don't care about the money for yourself, but you do (or do not?) care about money for your children?
How far away are you from your parents? Have you visited your mother? If you visit her regularly, you must be able to get information about her?
Does the bar buddy POA visit your father? I take it you don't care about your father, but only your mother, correct?
For some reason, your father is punishing you (you used the term "punish") by making his bar buddy friend POA (and maybe executor of the will, too?). Your father appears to want to cut you completely out of everything including any sort of financial AND medical decisionmaking.
Money has strings. My dad's a narcissist. I'd rather him use it for his care.
They're not far. I visit. I have access to my mother's medical information. I was there twice last week. We'll be going on mother's day. The POA is retired, he visits my dad. He has a lot of free time.
My father is a cruel man. We've had problems for years. I love my father. I don't like him.
He is definitely punishing me. He treats me like I'm 10. I should follow his orders, do as he's says without an opinion. He wanted me to handle all medical...to be at his beck and call. I have a little one and obligations. I'm not getting child care (I don't have anyone for that anyway) so that I can take them both to all their appointments (numerous specialists) my dad schedules when I'm supposed to pick up my kid. I'm not cleaning crap and doing laundry to be told I'm not doing enough. I'm not being cursed at because I'm not jumping when he tells me to jump. All that and I should smile while thanking him for my existence.
He doesn't think my child should take precedence over his needs. He doesn't think my mom's cancer and impending death supercede his needs. His comments last week were "what about me? And his buddy "does everything he says without argument ". 🤷🏻♀️
This is what happened with my father. The NH tried to be slick. I was ready for it because I communicated with the probate court twice a week to check the names on the docket.
There is immediate POA which is in effect as soon as Dad signed the paper. Springing POA needs a doctor or more to say the principle is no longer competent to make informed decisions.
I would talk to the Administrator and ask that he/she request a copy of the POA to establish that its in effect. Also explain, if there is a POA and it is in effect, its for Dad not Mom so this buddy has no say in Moms care. He is not her POA. If they don't still seem to understand this, tell them to have their facility lawyer explain it to them.
I think the whole thing is spousal as far as treatment.
In text I told the nurse practitioner if there's a medical POA they should have a copy.
That's why my feathers are ruffled at the suggestion that I speak about mom's care with dad's buddy. He should have zero input and stay in his lane...at the bar where my dad found him.🤣
Nurse practitioner said he was unfamiliar with POAs...I think speaking out of turn.
I feel like the hell a few of my dad's friends put us through when my dad had the stroke and we were left with zero guidance from my dad regarding my mom is enough contact for a lifetime. Especially, when I begged him to hire an aide to help out. Two months later he allowed it. The week before he came home.
He kept secrets regarding the severity of her dementia. He never told us of her incontinence, etc. he actually said the neurologist said she doesn't have dementia. I took her last June, he said yes she has dementia. Alzheimer's and possibly vascular.
She couldn't use a microwave, pooped all over the house, wouldn't shower, took my dad's meds and she was allergic to two of them, couldn't use the remote control, chronic uti's, would forget to eat.
I've never seen so many "friends" jump into a family scenario without knowing basic medical history. They were giving her cigarettes, wine, telling her to erase the white board with her appointments. That she's fine. It was a complete hot mess.
The director told me last week that the supposed "POA" told her my mom was fine and moving about before she went into the rehab a few months ago. That's a complete fabrication. She had a host of issues and was basically wheelchair bound.
Mom had mini strokes, vascular disease, COPD, nodes and nodules in her lungs, bypass surgery in her leg, two carotid artery surgeries, high blood pressure, diabetes, diverticulitis...which lead to a colostomy bag. The most recent before the rehab were three broken bones on top of her foot. The live in aide and my dad wouldn't allow me to bring her to the ER. I had to listen to the aide. They finally allowed it on a Saturday. But I couldn't get her into an orthopedic until Tuesday. She went an entire week with broken bones.
I said in another comment my dad can take his money and ride off into the sunset on his scooter...I really feel that way.
I just want to know about my mom's medical situation. As long as I have access to that (which I do) I have no need for his buddy.
You know, calling this person doesn't obligate you to do anything. It doesn't mean you have to maintain a relationship with this person, or even talk to him beyond telling him you're done with the entire situation. If you can really "walk away" without any sort of regrets later on, then I guess follow your instincts and do nothing...but since you're here asking this question and justifying not calling this man, it seems to me like you're not sure if this decision is the right thing.
Anyway, that's my personal opinion...absolutely no judgement on my part if you choose not to take it to heart. I wish you peace no matter what you decide and offer you my sympathies on your mom. Good luck.
Zero contact. I'm not concerned with the financial. Only my mom's medical. I personally feel he shouldn't be putting his two sense in regarding my mom. He's nothing to her. She was never able (for years)to sign a POA, so he's not hers.
He showed up when my dad had the stroke. Never a holiday, birthday, medical episode for mom. He knows nothing of her medical history. 🤷🏻♀️
That's not for Dad to decide. Mom decides who she wants as POA. But as you said, now it's too late. Mom can't sign POA anymore. She's mentally incapable.
Summary:
Your Mom has no POA (health or financial).
Your Dad has financial POA (buddy).
I think there are several hypotheses:
1. Your Dad is confused, unaware of what he actually signed. In that case, you can't trust any of the details he says.
2. Your Dad isn't confused at all, but he lies to you OP about the details.
3. Your Dad isn't intentionally getting things confused; he's starting to have dementia.
Anyway, I think it's better you contact the buddy, see what's going on.
Your father (if you will pardon me for saying so) is an old fool to think that by making his drinking buddy POA that it will somehow protect their assets for the grandkids.
It won't. The drinking buddy is probably ripping him off and thats why he doesn't argue about anything.
How were you paying the bills when you had the financial POA? Are your parents independently wealthy and can easily afford to pay cash every month for both of them to live in the care facilty?
Or do they have a spectacular LTC insurance policy?
It's one or the other for how their bill gets paid. If they don't have either then Medicaid is paying so there isn't any inheritance to preserve for grandkids or anyone else.
If I were you I would have no contact with your father. He treats you like garbage and clearly has no respect whatsoever for you. So when the whole thing goes belly up don't clean up the mess he's made or put out his fires.
It isn't your responsibility anymore.
When my dad was in rehab at the time of his stroke he gave me is passwords for his online bank pay and atm card. I kept impeccable receipts for him. When he returned home, he assumed his responsibility back. He's obsessed with his bank account. I guess that's a good thing.
OP, maybe your Dad is very confused about what exactly he signed.
1.
If buddy is executor, it's not ONLY for the grandkids' inheritance. In a will, you can't have one executor for X assets, another executor for Y assets. You can only have ONE executor who executes the whole will.
2.
If buddy is authorized to help pay taxes, bills, he indeed has a financial POA with full access to money. Your Dad must go to the bank with buddy, to fill in the bank's additional, required POA papers. Maybe your Dad already did it.
3.
The facility keeps telling you to contact the POA, obviously for some important reason. You don't want to speak to the buddy. I think you better talk to the buddy.
If that's the case it only took a few months for that to happen.
I feel as long as I have access to my mom's medical updates from staff, which I do, then I have zero need to take to his buddy.
The minute his buddy pisses him off, he be pushed aside too. 🤷🏻♀️
When he found the al facility, he didn't tell us until 3 days before the move. He had a friend that visited almost every morning with coffee and donuts, he didn't know until the morning of. The cops were dispatched to my house a few weeks ago, because another friend called for a well check. My dad wasn't returning calls, so he/she called the police. We bought the house from them Sept 2021...he didn't change his address. So the cops came to last address on record(license). My dad thought it was funny.
Isn't that what counts here?
Is it possible that the NP is trying to nudge you in the direction of contacting the POA because he knows/suspects that Dad has dementia/mental health challenges?
Mom doesn't have a POA. She can't sign anything for POA.
I can't even.
My mom was in rehab a few months ago. They were living independently with a live in nurse for almost 6 months. My mom was in pain, I kept saying she needed to go to the ER. The hospital released her to a rehab facility, because she was a major fall risk, could barely walk and in severe pain. Meanwhile, the rehab said she can't return home, so my dad found an assisted living with memory care. Mom went straight to the al after a month and a half to 2 months at the rehab. She had zero improvement.
Yes, I don't want to speak with my dad's buddy at all. I'm not exactly sure why they keep insisting. I'm not sure who I contact to say this guy is not someone I want to be in contact with. So far two employees at the al mentioned him. 🤷🏻♀️
It can be done, and whether you can do it gradually or abruptly, it can be a useful mental health tool for you.
Do you know as a fact that your father has legal jurisdiction over your mother? If not, you may be able to assume or at least partially establish legal control for her care. Find out.
A legal consult to find out where everyone is legally in your father’s game might be good for you. Look for a geriatric or family practice lawyer.
See if you can make a connection with an Adult Protective Services office in your parents’ area. They may be able to make suggestions for local types of assistance for untangling family situations like yours.
Please know that although it feels like it, you are not alone in your feelings about your situation.
You are smart and caring, and you need to be vigilant in taking good care of yourself, to do the best possible for your mother’s care.
Thinking about you……..
She's in hospice and getting very good care. Legally there isn't paperwork regarding my dad over my mom. They're honoring spouses wishes at the nursing home. My dad's buddy couldn't have my mom sign anything with her diagnosis.
It wouldn't be smart to have the same individual be a medical and financial POA either.
The nurse practitioner used the POA term liberally and didn't seem to know the difference between medical vs financial.
He said my dad's buddy just keeps saying he's POA.