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My Mom's assisted living facility has already given us the run-around, saying that they gave my mother a sponge-bath (it didn't happen) because they said she didn't want a shower because she was already dressed. They also said that the reason that my mother had to wait for over an hour one day to have someone respond to the call button is because she calls too much. (The reasons they gave me were weak.) (And by the way, my mother is not allowed to try to navigate on her own. She needs help.) Now, last night, I arrived at the facility at 6:10. After half an hour we decided to begin her exercise routine (walking in the hall). When she stood up at her walker, I noticed that her wrist call button was blinking. She said that she had pushed it before I arrived because she needed someone to help her to the bathroom. I helped her to the bathroom and then we sat and waited for the aide to arrive. We thought it would be rude to leave when my mother had called for help, because the aide would expect her to be in her room and we didn't want her to have to track us down. At 7:20 the aide showed up and asked what my mother wanted. She claimed that she had just gotten the message on her "pager." She said sometimes it "spins" because the message takes a long time to go through, like on the computer when it takes awhile for something to load. She tried to show me that it showed my mother as being "inactive" on her pager, but of course, I couldn't see the display well, plus the clock was not set on her pager, so it didn't give correct times. I like this aide, so I wanted to believe her, but also didn't know if she was just trying to cover for herself. If, in fact, it can take one hour and ten minutes to respond to a call for help, that is very concerning to me, especially with what has already happened in the last two weeks.

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It would be concerning for me too. Talk to the RN in charge. If you get nowhere there talk to the Administrator. An hour is a long time to wait to go to the bathroom. I will say, that after dinner is a hectic time. The residents are taken back to their rooms to get ready for the night. Not being put to bed just getting them settled in and watch TV, etc.
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I would follow up with the admin or whoever’s in charge of the paging system. One hour 10 minutes is unacceptable, but if theres a problem with their WiFi or transmission they need to know it. If there are dead spots in the facility where the signals don’t come in they need to get it fixed. Moms NH call buttons trigger a light by her door in the hallway. I did notice once that her button was on but the light wasn’t and maintenance fixed it, but that’s the only time. After the button is pushed, and the light goes on, the aid gets paged after 10 minutes. After 20 minutes the charge nurse gets paged. But if I’m there and moms buttons been on for 20 minutes, I’m scouring the halls for help anyway.

But this his concerns me “They also said that the reason that my mother had to wait for over an hour one day to have someone respond to the call button is because she calls too much.” WTH? Did you ask them to clarify what she’s needing during these multiple calls. Are they really needs like potty, or are they easier things like providing tissues or water that could be addressed in a different way?
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When my parents moved to AL, they experienced many problems with slow/no response to the call button. I complained politely but persistently to the administrative staff and the RN in charge of care staff. They finally decided that the wearable call buttons were malfunctioning and replaced them. We continued to have some trouble with slow response due to staffing issues, and I politely and persistently followed up with the administrator and RN. It became very apparent that management's ideation of the level of service they were able to provide was quite different from what could be achieved by the hands-on care staff.

It was frustrating because my mother was considered "level 4" on the care scale and was charged the highest rates, but the facility did not seem at all prepared to deal with the needs of a level 4 resident.

I would be very concerned about the comment that your mother had to wait over an hour because she calls too much. She is, no doubt, paying for a certain level of assistance and if she's calling for things they don't normally include in her level of care, they need to address that with you and with her. If they simply ignore her calls or let her wait because they view her as a nuisance, they are opening themselves up to a big lawsuit if she ever has a fall and they let her lay on the floor for an hour because she calls too much.. Please be sure to let the administrator know that this comment was made and that you are concerned about the call response time.
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@rocketjcat. How interesting that you mentioned tissues and water. That’s exactly what the nurse in charge told me she was calling for. My mother has at least six boxes of Kleenex in her room, definitely close by her bed and chair and the same thing for water. My mother was shocked when I went to her and calmly told her she shouldn’t call for water or Kleenex. She said that she never has. I went back and told the nurse and she took me to the night aide who said yes, she called for Kleenex, water, to have the blanket put over her knees, to gave her pants pulled up. I said, what? When is she asking to have her pants pulled up? The answer was —in the bathroom. That’s when she lost me. Why would she complain about that????? She said she called to have her pants pulled up when she was in the bathroom. I have more to say to respond to what the people who responded to my question said, but that will have to wait until tomorrow. It’s late. Thanks for your support!
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@funnymomof3  I talked to the receptionist last Wednesday (9 days ago) about the things that had happened. She said, "Oh, no. That's not right." You will get a call about this today from the director or the head of nursing. She wrote up a long documentation of what had happened and later talked to the director. The next day she asked me if I had gotten a call. She said the director wanted to interview the people involved. And then, nothing. No call. Nothing.  Last night, the cna that I like (who kept my mother waiting for one hour and ten minutes) told me that if my mother has to use the bathroom one and a half hours after she took her to the bathroom after dinner, that is too soon. Two hours would be OK, but not one and a half hours. She said, "This is assisted living." Then she asked my mother if she drinks too much. I told her, don't say that to her because I have finally gotten her to drink. She wouldn't use to drink much because she didn't want to have to use the bathroom so much. Finally, she drinks a little more and I don't want to discourage her. I just wanted to cry that the woman said that's it's unacceptable that my mother needs to use the bathroom a little more often than she thinks is acceptable for an assisted living facility.
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funnymomof3 Aug 2018
I am sorry this is happening to you and your mother. People need to go to the bathroom when they need to go . . . not according to a pre-set schedule. And fluids are necessary!

Have you considered looking for another facility? It may be that the facility that your mother is living at is not prepared to offer the level of assistance that she needs. (Which sounds pretty basic.)
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maybe you should tell them & maybe you should look for another place ..maybe that will wake them up ..
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No, computers don't make too many mistakes, but humans do ignore computers. My mom was a rehab center for two weeks. I can't tell you how many times I would be there and someone's call button would go off for hours. Why? The CNA thought it was just waste of time to respond to all the calls unless the person went into cardio arrest and then..WELL! We can't lose this paying customer. So, away they went to save the day.
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Sad to say, but welcome to Assisted Living/Nursing Home Care. This happens most places you go. When my uncle was alive, I switched homes so many times in hope the next one would be better, it wasn't. The care for the elderly is horrific. I can't tell you how many times I heard someone died because they fell out of their bed. I no longer believe this. I am convinced all the elderly people could not get assistance and fell trying to get to the bathroom themselves. My uncle gave up because he said they wouldn't help him and he couldn't do things.My uncle died because they made a medication error which made him fall 5 times in one week always in the bathroom. He stubbed his toe, went to the hospital for the fall, recovered and was ready to come home. However, the infection set in from stubbing his toe and he got MRSA and died. I am going to counseling because he screamed for hours before he died, he lost his ability to communicate. If you get no answers or improvement, file complaints with the dept of health. Although these places are good at doctoring up records and hard to prove what they are doing, they may catch them one of the times they go out. They couldn't prove aids didn't help my uncle, but they did find the medication error. I have tried to get a movement started to demand better care, but no one seems to want to bother. We will all be there some day and then we won't have a voice. I'm very frustrated we can't change things now.
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SKGCarepartner Aug 2018
I am so sorry for your experience, and the experiences of all the responders. I wonder if we shouldn't start sending these descriptions of our loved ones' traumas to an organization like AARP or ACLU, to encourage them to lobby/sue our legislators into cleaning this problem up? And, of course, we ALL need to VOTE for whoever we believe will stand up for us on all levels of government. What do others think?
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Sunnydayclouds,
It's time to call the local Ombudsman Supervisor and file a formal complaint about these issues. Call lights should be answered within 10-20 minutes, and 20 minutes is pushing the limit. Not answering the call light because mom pushes the button too often is considered neglect. Encouraging a resident NOT to drink makes for a lazy CNA. Who's to say how long it should be between bathroom visits? Try and document these issues.
You can find the Ombudsman's contact information for your mom's assisted living facility posted where the residents and their families can find it ... at least that is the law. If not, it's another issue, but you can call the Area Agency on Aging in the area and ask for the Ombudsman. Good luck.
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I experienced similar problems at my parents AL facility. My mom was on the highest level of care and needed help with just about everything and we also hired private caregivers for 4 hours everyday to help engage my mom in activities. We had numerous instances where wait times were very long. This was frustrating knowing my mom was on the highest level of care and we were paying for care she was not receiving. I had the private caregivers document each instance of long response times and I went to the person above the facility director after several tries addressing with the director. He seemed concerned and we met up and he told me what all they were doing to address these issues. Bottom line was they were woefully understaffed most all the time, especially on weekends. One aide for 90 residents is ridiculous. They always had some excuse about someone not showing up for work etc. I had had enough and was in tears when I showed up one Sunday morning at 10:30 and my mom was soaking wet since they did not have time to get her out of bed and change her at the agreed upon 9:00 wake up time. That next day I found a new place to move my parents to and I let the VP know I expected him to release my parents of the 30 day notice requirement because they were not providing the care we had signed up for and were paying for. He could not argue this and let us out of the contract. My parents are now in a memory care facility that is properly staffed and no more long wait times. I can always find someone around to assist my mom when needed. What we pay now is about the same as what she was paying at the last place and the level of care is worlds above the old place. There are some great places out there that do provide high levels of care. My parents both have some cognitive impairment, but not where they would have to be in memory care. But my mom needed this move because they are so much better equipped to provide the care than the last place. So do search the area for other options and ask lots of questions of prospective places and hold them to the level of care you are paying for.
Good luck.
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My wife and I had similar instances. Repeatedly! I am a licensed attorney in Illinois but our experiences happened in Colorado. I expect to become licensed in Colorado pretty soon and will, if I live long enough, will file suit against the guilty parties.

These problems need fixing, but perhaps there are lawyers out there who would take action ASAP, as lives are at stake. I hope so and so should we all.
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I don’t know what to say. Hearing this breaks my heart. If your loved one can even be aware enough to use a call button and then have the call be ignored, is just beyond inhumane. No matter what the reason is, if a person needs help, a person needs help. My parents told me that nobody comes when they pull the cord, but they also tell me that so and so was upstairs today( there is no upstairs at their facility). After reading these posts, now I’m wondering if the statements about nobody coming to help are true. I’m sick to my stomach thinking I’ve sent my folks to an earlier death bed.
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sunnydayclouds Aug 2018
Alzh101 I don’t know what you mean when you say you wonder if the statements about nobody coming to help are true. I sat there and waited with my mother for over one hour and ten minutes before anyone came. Today, a lovely woman who lives on my mother’s floor showed me all the bruises on her knee and leg from falling on the slippery floor in her bathroom. She didn’t call for help because she was able to get up on her own. She and I had already talked about how sometimes there are long wait times. (She initiated that discussion.) She is able to get around pretty well on her own, but uses a walker for stability. I wondered what would have happened if she had hurt herself more seriously when she fell and needed help right away and help didn’t come.
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a friend of mine works at the front desk at a very fancy AL facility, and sadly, all day long, residents ask for her help to take them to the bathroom. Unfortunately she is not allowed to take them because she’s not a Personal Care Aide- so she tells them “I’ll call the nurses aide for you “ ..... but the aides don’t always come. the aides would rather have them “go” in their diaper and change the diaper, than actually assist them going to the bathroom because it’s easier!
she said “it’s so sad” but there aren’t enough staff to toilet all the residents, and they’d rather change diapers on “their” schedule.
😢
this HAS to change!
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rovana Aug 2018
To improve things?  IMMIGRATION.
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These stories are devastating to read. And it's obvious to me that the less we're able to pay, the worse treatment our LOs will receive.

On the other hand, my daughter is a nurse who worked for almost 2 years in a rehab dept. at a local hospital. I could see the fatigue in her eyes and the stress from the pressure at work, dealing with just these kinds of things. And I don't think the answer to this problem is simply "pay higher wages," although, at the aides' level especially, I'm sure that's part of it. But as a nurse, my daughter was doing okay financially. Even so, she ended up leaving and changing fields because of burnout.

It seems to me that, with such a large population of disabled, aged and aging right now, investigations need to be taken by a lot of different organizations, e.g., AARP, ACLU, The National Association of Nurses, various geriatric associations and, ultimately the Dept. of Health and Human Services and the Secretary of Health. Have I missed anyone? To ascertain what the specific problems are, both for the residents and their families, and for the facilities and staff. Ultimately, we need legislation and, I'd bet my bottom dollar, we need funding at the federal level. This would all take time, of course. But if we increased the numbers of members of whatever organizations for the elderly/disabled we choose, I can't see why we wouldn't have enough power to push things forward faster. Yes?
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Some AL places give excellent care. Sadly my Mom lived in a lovely place that was an insult to the dignified seniors paying good money to live there. People waited hours, yes hours to be helped to the bathroom. They were left alone on toilets just as long. Baths charged to residents didn’t happen. Scheduled checks in the middle of the night didn’t happen. During the night, sometimes there was only one person to respond to the call buttons of over a hundred residents and sometimes they couldn’t leave the desk. All of the above was before they were sold to a corporation and things really went downhill.
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rovana Aug 2018
If we cut off immigration, it is going to get worse...For many Americans these jobs are not good enough, but for many immigrants they are definitely a step up.
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This is my second post. It is very refreshing to hear that people want to do something. It's good to see that people realize this is just not one bad Assisted Living or Nursing Home. It has become our standard of care for the elderly. I'm not sure if I have the year correct, but around 2020, there will be more elderly than young. They are starting to prepare for it now. However, if the care is this bad now, how bad will it be then? I have got a lot of good input from this discussion and I will follow up the ACLU and Office on Aging. However, the Office on Aging here in Ohio seems to side with them. I think these comments do need to be made public so that people see what a widespread problem this is. Another good idea is calling our representatives to see what is being done about this. Thank you for brainstorming some really good ideas. I will follow up and do my part!
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sunnydayclouds Sep 2018
Thank you!
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Well I had a long response started but it somehow got erased. I can tell you that my recent experience in the rehab part of one of these facilities was horrible. First, contact the Nursing Supervisor of your Mom's floor and tell her the problems you are having getting a timely response to her nursing call. Also get names and times it took to get a response. How do they know it's not an emergency? On the day I was admitted, I had to wait 8 hours for my pain medications. They were very lax delivering all medications to me. Also, nurses did not answer call buttons but the care techs did. They also handed out medication, which I have since found out is not legal. Sounds like your Mom has been placed on the "rings too much" list and they make the patient suffer for this. I would do as much research as possible to locate a patient oriented facility instead of a "don't bother us" facility. I won't mention my facility by name, hopefully you will have better luck and better patient care than I found. Start with contacting the Supervisor first with your facts. My care did improve after I did that. I contacted her with all complaints and they were all resolved. If they don't resolve things then I would seriously look for a better place. Ask anyone you know who had a family member in a similar situation.
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Talk to the Administrator.What this CNA is telling you is wrong.Most facilities are required to answer a call light in 15 min.( I am a former CNA and a housekeeper in Nursing homes.)What would be their response if your mother fell and pushed her button for help.This is a form a neglect.If this continues look for another Nursing Home
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GraceLPC Aug 2018
Talk to staff, or if you can track down former staff. Job search & resumecsites might help.
I too have worked as an NA. I have friends in the field. In Peoria I found that in many locations, over half, a Sr staff or CNA who has been there a while, will refer friends and relatives for any openings. These positions are often hard to fill. So NH ends up staffed by people who will protect each other over the patients. NH doesn't rock the boat for fear large portion of staff will leave at once, and may then report the neglect they were part of to the state. So Lok out for too much nepotism or cronyism among the staff as a huge Red Flag!
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The day after the first incident, I went to interview the director of the place my mother’s case manager had recommended (too late). They CARED at this facility. But, if I moved my mother I would lose the $2000 community fee that we had to pay upfront at her current place. We would also miss all the wonderful residents that we have gotten to know. I’m still gathering information. I would think that the people in charge would be horribly embarrassed to offer such inadequate care.
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jazzie6015 Aug 2018
If you complain or are one that is going to watch everything they do, they may give it back. But many times, I moved my uncle from place to place, hoping the next one was the good one. Never found it...probably 6 or 7 that I tried. Sorry to be so negative, but been there done that. There are rarely a very few good ones. I pray that you find that one.
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Get Elder Care Attorney, Medicare Ombudsman, States Attorney, plus Dept. that licenses NH in your state.
These things happen to me. Staff RN said I was faking convulsions. Said if I passed out in on toilet, how could I have known the time... because they would frequently take 40 minutes to get back to me!
I wished I had an advocate to take the above actions for me!
If allowed, put in Nanny Cams...check state law. Don't tell them.
I nearly died because missed medication doses threw off labs. Doctor thought increase in previous test was an anomaly, didn't know T had missed 2 doses in 72 hours before the test. By next time they ran the test I was Toxic...every symptom but coma & death. Has those symptoms for months, but once labled as faking, Somataform, obsessed with your health... it's a real battle. This place was highly rated. Some great staff, but some lazy & vendictive. My observation is most are understaffed, especially at mealtime.
Patients awoken at 5am for bath and dressing, to be lined up in wheelchairs for hours to make it easier for LPN to hand out meds.
I was told they could not give me RXs as prescribed because, " they can't be making trips every hour to give me meds!". An exaggeration. Finally a night nurse asked if she could give me anti-malware med before she went off duty. That way it was in my system when I took combination that required 3 RXs to keep it down. There is a reason doctors write orders with time frames!!! It is their duty to follow those orders!
I have run into this problem with medication when hospitalized. Took days to get me all my Meds at proper times!
The medication they skipped, was saving my kidneys. They doctored their records. You have the legal right ( as MPOA or Patient) to know the name of every RN, Dr., and Tech on every shift.
If they know you are watching, they will try to claim you are cured, to get you out, OR up their game for fear of a lawsuit or losing their license.
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Hello!! Yes this sort of thing happens in assisted liveing homes often I think because they never have enough help .the assisted liveing home is trying to keep their rooms filled therefore they keep residents that require much more care than a assisted liveing can handle .Then they do not have proper maintenance because they want to save money but your caregiver may be just overwhelmed with too many difficult residents....
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sunnydayclouds Sep 2018
I think you hit the nail on the head. Fill the rooms and don't provide enough people to care for these residents. You would think they would want a good reputation and good reviews, but in the end, dollar-wise, it isn't worth it for them because profit is the bottom line. I was encouraged yesterday about my mother's situation. Her aide yesterday said that they put it in the notes for her that when she pushes the call button, they should respond right away. At least they are addressing my complaint and trying to make a positive change. We'll see if there is follow-through. Of course, no one has ever spoken to me in person about it. I've asked for a meeting, but have gotten no call back to arrange one. I would like to see a change for everyone. Everyone deserves good care and respect. If someone knows how to initiate change, I'll be happy to support that.
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remember the way assisted liveing is defined is 1 aide assistant not 2 there is a very thick line between assisted and skilled care homes .assisted is basically .the resident lives in an apartment and there is a babysitter in case someone falls light assistance to bathroom light assistance dressing and medicine remi ders is as far as meds are to go in assisted sooo there are several residents that are staying at your assisted liveing home but require MORE assistance than the criteria ...the 1 cna that's on staff with 20 residents is OVER WORKED & UNDER PAID
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Nursing homes are no better. My mom waited hours for someone to clean a bloody sore on her arm, apparently even though I asked 3 times the nurse told me it “went out if her head”. Mom waited up to 45 minutes for someone to take her to the bathroom, countless times. A woman in the rehab. room next to her waited 20 minutes for someone to take her to the dinning room, I finally took her. Her call button didnt work one day and if I didnt check on her she wouldn't have gotten dinner. I waited 10 days after we requested a hospice evaluation only to find out the RN on call the day we asked neglected to inform the Social Worker. My heart goes out to countless patients in NH that dont have anyone to advocate for them and help them get the help they needed and deserve.

One day an aide was sent home because they didnt need her, heaven forbid there be an extra person to help out. Something needs to change the way we treat our elderly, we might start not having so many homes that are for profit. The three months my Mom was in a nursing home was an eye opener.
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There are many good topics on this site and I love reading many of them. The care of Nursing Homes and Assisted Living Facilities has brought many interesting comments. I started a group called Elderly Lives Matter on Facebook. Please join the group so we can talk more in depth about this issue, brainstorm things we can do to stop the abuse that goes on. One person can't make a big difference, but many of us can. Please invite anyone to the group that is interested in finding a way to change this horrible standard of care. Thanks!
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For anyone interested, I had to change page to Elderly Advocates on Facebook
. It will be different from this site as it is focused more on advocating and making change. Hope to have your support. This site great for many different topics!
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(CBP711 wrote: Nursing homes are no better. My mom waited hours for someone to clean a bloody sore on her arm, apparently even though I asked 3 times the nurse told me it “went out if her head”. Mom waited up to 45 minutes for someone to take her to the bathroom, countless times. A woman in the rehab. room next to her waited 20 minutes for someone to take her to the dinning room, I finally took her.)

CBP711:

I agree 100 percent. My grandfather suffered terribly in these types of facilities. I finally took him home.

Yes it was terribly inconvenient, but I could no longer allow him to be treated that way.

Yes, many of these workers are underpaid, but it is not an excuse for neglect. If they do not want the job, do not take it.

It should be a calling like a pastor or a priest who earns very little money, too.
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jazzie6015 Sep 2018
After reading all these posts, it motivated me to start a page..Elderly Advocates...this has got to stop. Unacceptable.
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