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My 93-year old father (recently diagnosed with dementia and living independently, with my mother), fell in the apartment 12 days ago (in fact, he also brought my mother down, as he was trying to stop her walking out of the room but that's another story - she was OK). Ambulance was called as he couldn't get up and he was taken to hospital. Nothing broken - he had a scan and a full check-up and we assumed he'd be sent home almost straight away but he's been in there for 12 days. Part of the issue I think has been lack of carers/support for him once he was discharged, so this has caused a delay. He is in fact coming out today and hopefully with a care package (although this hasn't actually been confirmed). My concern is, that while he was in hospital, he deteriorated. For example, he has never done this before, but he wet the bed and soiled the bed, on 2 separate occasions and soiled himself during the day, while he was sitting in the chair by the side of the bed. Has anyone else had experience of this? Is it part of dementia or could it be the effects of being in hospital (I am hoping it's the latter and now that he's out, he will stop this, as it will be very difficult for my mother to cope with).

Helly's previous post indicated that the dad regularly keeps his wife from moving about freely and both are bruised from physical altercations. The title of that post is " I have to get my mom away from my dad asap"!!

Have you spoken to the social workers at the hospital about the situation in your parents' home? You have an opportunity here to place your father. I'm not sure I understand why you and your mom are not seeing that.

If dad is incontinent in the hospital, why do you think it will improve at home? Will he willingly wear pullups? Is your mother physically strong enough to change him if he resists?
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Reply to BarbBrooklyn
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Stephanie4181 Jun 22, 2019
Im sorry but if he can bruise his wife he can change his own damn diapers
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Has anyone suggested that sending him to a rehab center would be a MUCH better idea?

He must be quite de-conditioned, having spend 12 days in bed/a chair. Was he getting any physical therapy in the hospital? How far can he walk on his own?

In your shoes, I would ask for consideration of a few weeks of inpatient rehab. It will give you all a much better idea of whether this is the new normal?

Oh and....he was trying to keep your mother from doing what she needed to do? Do you see that as a ref flag for the fact that it may not be safe for him to be at home any longer?

I just checked and found your previous post: https://www.agingcare.com/questions/need-to-get-my-mother-away-from-my-father-asap-449012.htm?orderby=recent

Why are you even considering sending him home? He needs to be in long term care!
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Reply to BarbBrooklyn
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You have the perfect opportunity NOW to get dad away from mom. He is not a safe discharge for him or your mom. Take advantage of this situation, demand rehab, then a permanent placement for dad. Your mom cannot nor does she want to be his caregiver any longer.

Or just get mom out of there now!
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Reply to gladimhere
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Helly; your dad has dementia.

Allowing a dementia patient to call the shots is a classic "letting the tail wag the dog" scenario.

I understand that you respect and maybe fear your father's wrath. But if you all can't stand up to him (he's a bully; most bullies fold when you stand up to them, btw) then you need to step back and let the authorities take over.

I hope that you can get your mother to safety before this untenable caregiving situation does her any more harm.
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hellymart Jun 23, 2019
You are right. We are going to do something today. I will let you know.
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It’s possible that Dad has reached a new level in his disease, or he could be confused and anxious over his recent hospitalization.

Unsolicited advice: You say Dad is “hopefully” being discharged with a “care package.” You aren’t certain? Dad has cognitive issues, is a fall risk and now may be incontinent as well. You need to step in and make sure their discharge plan will keep them safe and get them the help they need. The fact that they kept him in the hospital for almost two weeks because they were concerned about lack of proper care for him is a serious red flag.

Even if Mom and Dad say they’re ok and even if on the surface they’re putting up a good front and refusing help, behind the scenes you and your sibs, if you have them, need to make sure they’re getting the help they need. The fact that they kept him in the hospital for almost two weeks because they were concerned about lack of proper care for him is a serious red flag.

Mom may say she’s ok and doesn’t need help, but I can tell you from experience that she needs help and probably doesn’t want to ask for it. If Dad is so needy that he would endanger himself and Mom by trying to grab her to keep her from leaving the room, their situation may warrant a discussion about ramping up his care.

I hope I’m off base here and that you and any sibs are keeping a close eye on them. However, because falls can happen in a split second, and this time, Mom was “lucky” and wasn’t injured, maybe it’s time to have a discussion about changes that might need to be made.
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Reply to Ahmijoy
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My opinion, you haven't realized how bad Dad really is. Medicare would not allow a hospital stay this long if there wasn't a reason. I am actually surprised he hasn't been transferred to a rehab.

I agree, this is the time to place Dad. You need a meeting with the DON to find out what is going on. Then u need to tell them what goes on in ur parents home. He can be put on Medicaid and placed in LTC. Mom will be considered the Community Spouse and will not made impoverished.

Him living with Mom is not fair to her. He may one day hurt her.
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hellymart Jun 21, 2019
I am not in the USA. We have no Medicare or DON (?)
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If you’ve been asking how to help Mom and get Dad away from her, now is the time! Tell them he is an unsafe discharge.
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Reply to rocketjcat
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My mom's decline started with a fall but in hindsight the fall was really just a symptom of her increasing frailty, something that had been happening so gradually that I had failed to notice even though I was with her all the time.

It seems pretty clear that he are no longer safe living alone in the community without 24/7 help, I agree with the suggestions to look into rehab for your father and some king of permanent supportive arrangement beyond that.
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Reply to cwillie
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Helly; I'm hoping that one of our UK posters will check in and tell you how to get your father placed.

Is your mother willing to say that she can no longer care for him? Is she willing to say "no, I won't take him home"? Is she willing to leave with you, at least temporarily?

Caregiving your difficult, mentally ill father is going to kill your mother. There really is no way to sugar coat that message; I saw it happen to two of my aunts. They were both convinced that only they could provide proper care for their husbands and "what would the neighbors think?".

Not surprisingly, both husbands lived quite contentedly in care for quite a while after their wives' demise. It's a very common, and very sad situation.

It's true, you can't force him into care. But you CAN say "we can no longer safely care for him" and "no, mother cannot do this alone".

By the way, when mom dies, are you going to move in with him to keep him at home? What is your plan for when mom expires? Believe me, I'm not saying this to be mean. You really need to think about what the long term plan is here.
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hellymart Jun 21, 2019
You are quite right, of course. My mother has to be the one to say 'I can't/won't do this any more'. When she says that, he will have no choice but to go into a home - and pay for it. We are going over tomorrow and my partner is going to talk to him. He might take more notice of him as he just speaks to me in the same way that he speaks to my mother - mostly with complete disrespect. Thanks for your reply. I will report back if/when there is some news!
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Thanks for all your responses, although, as I'm not in the US, most of them don't apply! I cannot force him to go into a home. He is a very, very difficult man (home now and he is refusing to take the medication that he was sent home from the hospital with, as he believes it's not the right stuff. He is waiting for a call from the ward so he can speak to a nurse and won't take it until she calls). He has carers coming in this evening and in the mornings, for the next few days, to help him get up, dressed etc but he is already indicating that he will be sending them away. He IS booked into a home for a week from early July and we are hoping that will be that and that he will agree to stay (you are all throwing your hands up in horror at this BUT we do not have POA - he refused it - and he is the only one who can afford to pay the £1100 a week charge for the home. The state won't pay it and we can't pay it so he HAS to be the one who agrees to going in and who will then pay it).
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shad250 Jun 21, 2019
Sometimes all you can do is shrug your shoulders and laugh.
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