Dad’s cancer, depression and extreme negativity. I don’t know what to do. At what point do I accept that he doesn’t want to be positive?

Five days and 24 answers later and the OP apparently hasn't been back to respond to any of the posts.

Time to close this thread for comments?

First off you moved into your Fathers house.
Did you ever stop to think that with everything he is going through that maybe having you there is hard on him?
What about his feelings, his pain, his journey to recovery?
It's not all about you.
If living in his house is bothering you, then you should find somewhere else to live, so he can deal with his own life.
It is not his fault you are having marriage problems, he probably just wants to be who he is, without any restrictions on his behavior, it is his house.
If he wants to complain or lash out he has that right, he is going through a lot, and it is painful, very painful.
Sounds like you need to find somewhere to live outside your parents home so you can heal and deal with your own issues.
Then you can find the compassion that your Father needs from you.

First things first: your mental health. You can't take care of anyone, or help anyone, if you aren't on solid footing. Living with my mom, I've gone to the effort to create emotional as well as actual separate space. You have to protect your energy!
Negative commenting becomes habitual -- my mother does it and it is soul killing for me. Sometimes I just say: "Mom, I want to be in a positive place right now." I won't ask her to stop anymore, she just gets defensive. But she does stop for awhile. And if she won't stop, I will just get up and leave the room if I can.
Next, getting space! Room dividers can do this, making your room a sanctuary, as well as creating a schedule where you can find time to feel "alone": when he is asleep, watching his tv, at the doctor, reading, whatever he does that doesn't need your interaction. That's right, have someone else take him to treatments and appointments. Senior services should be available to talk to about that.
Therapeutic massage by a good person can help relieve not just aches, but release the negative energy. Reiki or any "energy/body work" is recommended.
Use essential oils and aromatherapy for deep calm, peace...and meditate even 10 min. a day. Sound space, too, with meditative music is available on Youtube.

Now the difficult part is screening his negative comments. Like I say, it's awful for us sensitive people.
Get under your belt a few positive phrases and use them automatically. Not to fix or help him, and definitely not arguing with him, but to keep your energy in that calm place: "I honestly hope it can be better soon" "You have so much to handle, but I know you can do it." "I know this is very hard. I'm here." "I understand what you are saying" And of course the old standard, reflect back what he says. Like an echo. "Yeah, that is really hurting today!" "Yeah, this isn't your kind of food." "Those people don't do what you want." It's true to him, it's not trying to make him change, or worse, feel he's not being heard.
As for him telling you you are wrong, that is unkind and disrespectful. Don't engage, though. "Dad, I think I'm right about this. And don't want to argue with you." and move off to some other thing.
He isn't going to be changed or apologize or understand you any better. Save your energy for yourself. and get your own therapeutic support group or something. I'm looking for that.
If you think he'll hurt himself, tell his doctor. He may need a mental health assessment, and you can ask for it.
Take care and stay well.

From your comments you SEEM to feel that your father should be feeling normal and behaving normally whilst going through Chemo, and his failure to do so and to lash out, be miserable, rant, is something you should not have to put up with. Sorry but you are not the empath you claim to be or you would understand just how s*** he feels at times, how restricted, less of himself, useless compared to what he used to be. Chemo is damn hard work on the patient and they need every bit of support they can be given, not be expected to be nice and give support to others. He may want to be be positive but feels just too bad to be able to. Perhaps you should sit down quietly and talk to him about how he is feeling, what changes he feels the chemo and having cancer have made him feel etc. Find out about HIM and look at things from that side - you may learn a lot about loss of taste, sore mouth, nausea, irritation at his situation - you state this has got worse as chemo has progressed, but you don't seem to understand why/how it affects people. Maybe there is a book out there that would help, or talking to his Dr, joining a group of others in your situation. If he comes through his chemo successfully and is able to return to being himself I am sure the things you complain of will become far less of an issue.

I just read the other answers and am surprised how harsh some people have been. I totally sympathize that your father has cancer but that doesn't mean that you should suffer abuse at his hands either.

I stand by my earlier post. Disconnect! You can do it in a loving and kind way but you still need to protect yourself. Just my opinion. Take it or leave it.

hugs!!
i bet you are very empathetic!!

indeed, you cook healthy food for him. he doesn’t appreciate.

he argues with you about everything.

going through bad/horrible/terminal things in life, doesn’t mean the person is allowed to take it out on someone else.

lashing out is not ok.
not justified.

sounds also like he doesn’t appreciate all the effort you’re making: loving/nice meals, etc.

i hope soon things get better for you, and for your father.

i bet you’re doing a lot to show compassion.

protect yourself.
some people want to drag others down with them.

Ruby, as a fellow empath I sympathize. I soak up everything. Negativity affects me in a physical way. I lived with a schizophrenic brother growing up and I still have PTSD from that experience.

I think you need to put your own health first. I would disconnect from him. You may feel like you are letting him down but you won't be much good to him if you fall apart.

Maybe, seek counseling for him. From what you've told us he'll most likely respond negatively to that idea. But it's worth a try. Don't let him rob you of your youth.

RubySoho: Imho, it is no doubt very difficult for your father to be positive as he is suffering from cancer.

Your father is grieving.
Be compassionate.
Listen y to him.
He really needs you now.
He is scared , his life as it was is changing
Look over his snapping at you
He has every right to feel angry
Love him
You may not have him for long
Dont let his parenting in the past
have you mistreating him now





I am sixty eight.
Im in remission two years out from colon cancer.
My family acted like what i had was contagious

i was the driver child caregiver everything now i can’t do anything
the chemo did horrible things to my body
im no longer useful and they all resent me

i feel like i died and no one remembered to bury me















Believe me your father is going through something terrible.

Hes scared








plrase be kind to your fathet

You do not seem to be empathetic. Your father has a serious illness and can be negative or angry if he wants. Interventions are not warranted. Get out of his house and let him be. Your attitude does not seem to helpful or supportive.

Remove yourself from your father's home; it's his right to live in his own home however he sees fit. He's dying of cancer and probably isn't in the mood to be positive at the moment, which you should be able to understand yourself, since you're an adult. If you cannot live in his home and deal with the mood that's going on there, then your only choice is to leave. An 'intervention' is for someone who's an addict when you're trying to save their life. Not for someone who's dying of cancer and you feel it's necessary for them to be 'upbeat' so you don't have to live with negativity!!! I find your post to be shockingly unempathetic to what your father is going through as you seem only focused on what you are 'going through', which is very minor in comparison.

Chemo is a horrible horrible treatment for his body AND mind to undertake, plus he's now expected to eat a 'healthy' diet which doesn't taste good, on top of everything else. One of the last pleasures he has in life, stripped away too, on top of everything else. He's tired, in pain, frightened of dying, feeling the rotten side effects of chemo, eating food that tastes like sawdust, and expressing himself to his loved ones who are supposed to understand and sympathize with him. Yes, it's hard for all concerned, nobody is going to argue that: but it's hardest for HIM and probably for your mother who's doing the direct caregiving AND sleeping with him at night.

"Therapy" is designed to help someone find a fix for their situation; what's going to 'fix' your dad's situation, exactly? Nothing. Either the chemo will extend his life some or it won't, and the quality of his life during that time will be questionable. What do you expect him to gain from therapy besides another bill? Your father is trying to come to terms with his mortality right now, and there ain't nothin gonna fix that, my friend. Try giving him a big hug when he's raging and then leave the room to let him process his feelings. Perhaps a bit of therapy for YOU to figure out how to emotionally disconnect from this situation if you can't or won't move out would be in order. Or maybe you can glean some tips on how to help your dad to get through this ordeal emotionally without absorbing his pain yourself; that would be a blessing.

Wishing you the best of luck with a difficult situation.

Has he made a living will with his medical directives, and do you know what they are? Is his pain being managed adequately? Is all of his paperwork in order, in case he becomes unable to make his own financial or medical decisions? Are you his POA for medical decision? Have you talked to his doctor to find out what the prognosis is for your father's complete recovery? Make sure that you are in a position to help make decisions about his medical care. It's unfortunate that he is not being the loving and grateful father you'd like to have, and you are very young to be dealing with parent care, but try to do things that will help him get better and don't take his negativity personally. It may be his pain and his own worries that cause the negativity. And maybe you should seek counseling to be able to handle your own grief about your marriage and your father. You are in a difficult situation and you also need to take care of your own needs.

Is the chemo actually going to save his life or are they just going through the motions?

Seems like these are the bigger questions, enjoy the time you have left with your Dad the way he was rather then dragging out our medical systems attempt at saving him.

Personally I’m more about quality then quantity

First, the chemo is horrible. Its poison being pumped in your body. You don't feel like eating because everything taste like metal. You hurt, your tired and you are facing your immortality. The last thing you are is positive or want someone telling u should be positive. My sister had 8 months of chemo. Just about the time she was feeling better, she had another treatment.

Now you. I have been divorced and had to move home with a 1 yr old in tow. I had no job and no support. Yes, your self esteem goes down the drain but the breakup was not my fault. If you were abused, there is free help out there to help you deal. If you have no job, you need to get one. Its hard for children to take in parents, its just as hard for a parent to have a child move back in. They are used to being alone now there is someone else in the house.

For now, learn to read Dad. You can tell when someone doesn't want to talk. When they just want to be alone.

You have a lot on your plate and should not have more added to it by your father's behavior. Your obligation is to YOU and to take care of yourself first. Your father is angry, scared, sad and confused - he hates what is happening to him and he doesn't know what to do to fix something that can't be fixed. When this happens, we lose hope and lash out (I know - been there, due to what happened to me). We don't choose to be this way but our hearts and souls are broken - we can't act otherwise. Try to see if there is any medication to stop him acting like he does. And you must immediately set boundaries. Make it very plain to him that you will not tolerate his tearing you down and treating you badly and he either has to stop and get help or you will make immediate arrangements to remove him from your presence. No matter what the finances or other issues are, no one should ever be subject to abuse from someone else and must do whatever it takes - now - to make it end. You cannot change him but you can remove him and save your own soul and heart and sanity and I think you need to consider that before you are destroyed.

Loosing a dad and your marriage at such a young age. Does your dad qualify for any care by other than family, like hospice care? Try to keep your breathing deep and even when speaking with him. I use various mantras to stay on an even keel. One I use is "Bless it and release it." When you start to feel swept away by the negativity, find ways to recenter. An idea is to make a "sacred space" for yourself where you can retreat to and routinize your your contacts with your father. Like, if you are responsible for his meals or care make it a routine and try to prepare for it, a couple of days at a time. Needy people tend to start jerking you around. Anger is a way they bring their energy up, it feels good because the hormones are coursing through their bodies. Don't feel you have to answer every question or "be on call", just because you're present. I've been tempted to wear obvious earphone, like teenagers use to-as a visual cue that I'm not able to respond. Don't make your dad your lifework now. That's not your job. Find someone outside the family to vent to, who is constructive. Exercise, find new friends, who are uplifting.

Hi Ruby,

29 is a hard age. You’re old enough to be educated and in a career and a real adult (as opposed to the 18 yo newborn adult). You know a lot, but wisdom is one of the few advantages of seniority (and rare old souls) — it kind of makes up for furniture disease where your chest falls in your drawers.

You know the joy and hardship of being an empath, but maybe this is an opportunity to learn to guard yourself so you aren’t vulnerable to energy vampires. If yes, your dad is giving you a gift.

It may also be an opportunity to learn parenting 101 if dad’s acting like a brat who lets his emotion run ripshod over everyone, and you need to adopt a strategy to manage it. I’d start with calling him out in a way that doesn’t dismiss his feelings but doesn’t let them rule yours:
Dad, this healthy meal is for me. You can eat it or have a PB&J sandwich, Dad, I’m sorry you hurt but I can’t fix this. Dad, I empathize but I’m going to put on my earbuds now. Dad, here’s my suggestion; if you like it, fine; if not, I hope you have a better idea. Dad, I liked you better when you weren’t constantly criticizing me. Dad, I won’t stand here so I can be your whipping post. Dad, getting angry at me won’t fix this. Dad, calling me names (or whatever) isn’t productive so I’m walking away. Dad, I’m confused; if you don’t want me here I can leave. Dad, I have to focus on my job. Dad, dying means you’ve finished your visit at the amusement park Earth and are going home. Dad, you’re being a “little shit” (quoting my elder MIL) but I love you.

In other words, quietly, calmly, empathetically set your boundaries and personal goals & stick to them — but expect dad to dig in and go full tantrum before realizing he lost control (think toddler dropped off at daycare and howling to guilt mom/dad into staying).

Btw, you say you moved in with your parents. Where’s mom in this?

You got this. Figuring out the how to will add to your reservoir of wisdom. Good luck 🍀

Right now he seems to have a lot he's going thru and seems like he's dealing with it the best he can and that's being negative and mad at the world.
But, his Meds can certainly be the Culprit.
When around him, don't try to cheer him up, just agree with him, let him know you or sad and understand his situation sucks, because it does.

Limit the time spent around him.

Seek Counciling for yourself.

Can you and dad get our of the house and in to Nature...a Walk on a nice Trail in the Woods or the Beach, or have a pic nic at the park?

You would be surprised what a little fresh air and
sunshine lifts the Spirits.
Prayers

This is just a simple answer to your question: "At what point do I accept he doesn't want to be positive?" To me the most reasonable answer seems to be: now. He has terminal cancer. He has been through chemotherapy, which made him toxic. Yes, that is what chemo does! It is an awful treatment. He has every right to be mean, nasty and negative. He is fighting a battle for his life and most likely will lose it.

Would it be easier if he were cheerful, upbeat and raring to take on the cancer monster? Yes, of course. But he's not. He is likely afraid, angry and wishes he didn't have the disease and didn't have to deal with the awful treatment. He may not have the emotional and psychological capacity to cope in any other way. If possible, you must be kind, caring and compassionate and accept that he is at where he is at. I know that is easier said than done.

My dad lived with Stage 3 prostate cancer for 11 years. In the last year of his life he was pretty miserable, would often hang his head. I was usually annoyed with him and found it hard to deal with. During the last month of his life, he was impossible. Angry, insulting and miserable. In restrospect, I understand his reactions now. He was dying and he likely had many things in life that were unsaid or undone and he was despairing. I wish I could have been more caring and compassionate towards my father at the end of his life and I suggest you may attempt the same. It's hard but it's the decent thing to do.

1) "He has never been emotionally available my entire life, (But" and you know where those are) - It's interesting that you would go for water, so to speak, from a dry well, and get upset about it to boot.
2) Abusive relationship - A child growing up without love sometimes looks for the familiar.
3) Twenty-nine and at mommy and daddy's house. Not healthy. Besides broken tools can't help each other.
Sorry for being so blunt. Most of us, me too, learn the hard way and some take longer than others. You're lucky you're young yet, but barely.
Kindly, you're in no position to help your dad.
While you get yourself in a position to leave just listen, smile or lay low.
You need help to get a better picture of the world you create.
In case you haven't recognized it, I'm a long time listener to Dr. Laura.

Whenever I am about to give my opinion, I read what others have said and am amazed at how wonderful these responses are. I have nothing to add really except maybe to emphasize that you both need empathy which is what the responders have offered.

I just want to say I’m so sorry you have to deal with this AND your recovery from an abusive marriage. Have you considered utilizing a women’s shelter temporarily (just to get you back on your feet again)? It sounds like you are acting (to some degree) as a caretaker for dad, while you are trying to recover from your own psychological pain and stress. You may want to reduce your contact to visits with mom and dad until you feel healed enough to deal with your father’s struggles.

It’s also possible that you are not recognizing dad’s behavior towards you as part of an emotionally abusive parental relationship. You mentioned that “he has not been emotionally available to you your entire life”. I’m just inferring here, but it’s not uncommon for someone to end up in an abusive relationship (like you did) when they have had to deal with emotional abuse at home.

Some responders here, (like MJ1929) may not understand how toxic abuse can be. You need a place to stay, and you are also healing and in need of rest and a low stress environment. Find a shelter or friend to stay with and only visit dad when you feel emotionally capable of dealing with him - and don’t feel guilty about it! YOU have done nothing wrong. It’s terrible that your father has cancer, but you can’t be there for him as he struggles through his denial/anger stages if you’re not healthy enough yourself. It’s OK. You deserve this.

It might help to understand the stages of loss by Dr. Kubler-Ross.

Stage 1 - Denial - the feelings and actions that this "loss" isn't real

Stage 2 - Anger - the feelings and actions of anger that this "loss" or situation is unfair. Sounds a bit like the place your father is at.

Stage 3 - Bargaining - the ineffective actions and panicky. desperate feelings that if I do "___________." Things will go back to normal.

Stage 4 - Depression - the feelings and actions of sadness, regret, and depression when realizes this "loss" is not going away.

Stage 5 - Acceptance - the feelings and actions that denote coming to peace with the "loss" and accepting the "new normal".

Please check with your father's oncologist, local hospitals, churches, and online for a local support group. You need to find groups for yourself to find positive ways to move forward and deal with 2 losses. The first is deal with the separation or divorce from your spouse. The second is as a family member as somebody going through cancer. Your father would also benefit from a support group for people suffering/fighting cancer. He might also need a referral from his doctor for a psychiatrist for evaluation, diagnosis, and treatment of the mental health symptoms you mention. Just remember that your father has choice of whether or not he receives treatment for his mental health problems.

I would also recommend that you need some work on establishing boundaries on dealing with problem behaviors of others. Please read any of the "boundary" books by Townsend and Cloud. I find them to be practical and extremely helpful. You might wish to enlist the help of a counsellor or therapist as you create and implement plans for dealing with your father's negativity.

I think the first question is whether or not you can find alternate living arrangements after leaving an abusive marriage.   Is there some reason you have to live with your parents?

I think that your father is dealing with enough challenges from cancer that he might not be able to cope with an adult child in his home, unless you're specifically providing care for him, including meals that are cancer compliant, transit to and from medical appointments and chemo, if he's getting it.  

What kind of therapy have you encouraged him to get?   If it's not recommended by his oncologist, I can see why he might question it.

This isn't intended to be critical, but you're young, still have a lot of life ahead of you, but your father apparently doesn't.   And at 29 you still have a lot of working years left as well; I would focus on that, find a job and restore your own self esteem.   That might make it easier for the two of you to interact.

I emphasize that my comments are not intended to be critical, but observations of what I inferred from your post.

The man is in pain, feels sick all the time, is probably dying, and you wonder when you should accept that he's going to be a downer??

How about yesterday?

Yes, you have your troubles, too, but are you dying? Do you think he feels "emotionally safe" knowing he's dying? I'd love to know what positives you're pointing out that he's rejecting. Sorry, but I'd have a tough time being positive, too.

Sorry to be so harsh, but frankly, you've really missed what's going on because of your own issues. I get it -- life isn't a party for you right now either, but perhaps therapy is where you need to be instead of expecting your dad to be unchanged by the life-threatening situation he's in. You want Dad to be the rock he always was, but this is real life, and he's turning out to be human after all.

Work on your compassion, please. Cancer is horrific, and the treatments are, too. It makes a person turn inward and focus on fighting, and those on the outside often feel rejected and helpless to assist. It doesn't mean they shouldn't stop trying, though.

Seek support for your troubles elsewhere, like therapy, and don't look to your parents for anything other than shelter. Their hands are full with your dad's illness. This is full-on adulting, and it isn't fun, but sometimes you have to step up and handle your own problems without counting on your usual support system when they aren't emotionally available.

Welcome, Ruby. I'm sorry for the turmoil you are going through.

Is dad's depression being treated? Who is going along with him to doc appointments? Mom, you? Has anyone talked to his oncologist about his extreme negativity?