My mom fell, broke femur and was hospitalized. She was sent to rehab where it was determined she was going to need LTC. I filled out nursing home LTC application, not sure if that is just preliminary to actual Medicaid application. I believe I am eligible for a child caretaker exemption. Hoping to keep house from Medicaid and want to know at what point can she no longer pay her own mortgage in order to keep Medicaid eligibility.
You already filled the application. If she gets accepted, all of he income goes to her care except for $50 /month. There will be nothing to pay for house taxes and upkeep. Unless you need a place to live for a while and can cover those expenses. You cannot rent it either because rent is considered as her income. In the end, once she passes, Medicaid will try to recover those payments to LTC by focusing on the sale of the house.
As far as child caretaker exemption, I doubt you are taking her home.
I am curious...do you have POA? If you can respond, you will get a whole new thread of responses because it may affect you even being authorized to selling the home.
You really should see a lawyer
Whatever your situation, see an elder care attorney.
LTC tends to affix a “snapshot” date as to what their assets and income is. & the spend down, any transfers / gifting, etc affix that date for the look back. & as far as I’m aware it’s the date of application filing. I’m sure it can be dealt with but it just more attorney work & fees.
for couples filing where 1 is NH and the other is staying in the community spouse (CS), the snapshot day is super important as any $ moves from joint accounts to the CS for the CS to set aside for their own allowed segregated asset (tends to be 130K) should be done b4 the snapshot. Otherwise the NH spouse could have to spend it down. Not good.
So, the last year I applied for her was 2016 because I felt she deserved it. Mom stopped paying taxes in May 2017 when I applied for Medicaid. So, I did not apply for Homestead or Senior rebate by for that year.
For renewals, Right of Return document was included in the renewal packet. So Medicaid imo is paying attention to property records, transfers, etc. I think it’s red flagged to their LTC Medicaid # & linked for future recoup. I do think a lot of what happens is interdependent on your States property laws. For those that are real pro-real property rights - eg allow for easy TOD or do Lady Bird Deeds, like MI, TX, FL - they cannot remove a homestead exemption if that individual who owns the property continues to do things to keep a “modicum of presence” at the address.
There is someone currently on this forum dealing with her Hubs Aunts property in this situation. Auntie is in a NH on LTC Medicaid and still has her home w/Lady Bird set to go to nephew (the Hubs) & her. (House flooded right b4 Auntie went into NH so no way to ever FMV or deal with listing). It’s still the same system with annual Right of Return filing & very time sensitive. FWiW we both have had attorneys deal with aspects of this. You can only DIY so much imo.
The biggest take away to me in elder keeping their home and be on LTC Medicaid & family supporting this - imo - is that someone in this drama…. whether its a long time in the home caregiver seeking caregiver exemption or POA who lives elsewhere doing other exemptions or exclusions to recovery…. they need to have on their own the financial ability (& sense of humor) to take on all expenses on a property they may or may not acquire, do it for an unknown amount of time & for possibly years and OK on the risk on doing so.
To me, having a mortgage - unless teeny and about to be paid off - can be the deal killer in keeping house as having a mortgage means Note must be paid every month without fail, the property MUST be fully insured for whatever hazards for your area (homeowners, flood, wind, earthquake) & insured high enough to be ok for mortgage company AND house must be maintained and stay repaired. Property taxes must be paid. Mortgage will require all this. A house that’s paid off, does not have those demands & you can juggle what gets paid as a priority if $ gets tight.
I read your profile and looks like you are not entitled to the Caregiver allowance. My understanding is you must reside at the same address of the person being cared for and care for them at least 2 yrs. Must be related. I think it has to be a matter of you have kept the person out of a NH by caring for them in their home. You also must be able to keep up the Mortgage, upkeep, taxes and utilities. I would call a caseworker at your County Social Services office to see if my info it correct. I would say this all needs to be worked out before the Medicaid application is completed. If your using the NH to file, be on top of them. Know who Moms caseworker is if you have questions. I used a Medicaid caseworker to help me with the application. He then handed me a list of things that needed to be done within 90days from date of application. If not done, you start all over. In my State, you must be spent down to 2k and have all info in, and cannot be over the income cap allowed which was for Mom 6 yrs ago $2300. She was way under that cap. Be aware, that Moms Social Security and any pension will go towards her care. She will have no money for the house so, it may need to be sold and must be at Market rate if u do not qualify for the Caregiver allowance.
But let’s back this up a bit….. has anyone mentioned SOC at all to mom or you? I’m guessing “NO”?? Ok & if so, you imho need to be aware of this - the SOC - & what it means asap. LTC Medicaid requires those in a facility to basically have all monthly income less a smallish PNA (personal needs allowance) go to NH as their share of cost each & every month once they file for LTC Medicaid. BUT some States cannot collect this till applicant/resident in the NH has actually had their application fully processed….. which could take 3 - 6 months. So that mo income of SSI is sitting in mom’s bank account winking. U aren’t aware of SOC so go and spend some of it and then Voila! 5 months later a huge butt amount of $$$$ due to NH thats owed and right now and it’s a problem as you used the $ to pay the mortgage, pay the yard guy, pay taxes. And if you don’t pay the NH within 30 days or less, mom is out of compliance for LTC Medicaid rules and everyone in this drama has problems. If this is you, asap speak with billing at the NH regarding the SOC and the PNA and how moms State Medicaid approaches it.
LSS paying mortgage, taxes, utilities, yard work etc all fall outside of what is allowed use of moms $. Her monthly income will eventually all go to her SOC less whatever her State has as its PNA. PNA avg $50/$60. Only way I’ve ever heard around this is UNLESS she is going to put house up for sale AND she or you as her POA files for a specific waiver to have mortgage amount held back from her SOC and then house has a MLS listing (no FSBO nonsense). waiver is good maybe 6 months on a FMV motivated selling with MLS listing. Medicaid allows for this as it’s better than elder loosing house to foreclosure. This way elder sells the house, they then have house sale $ to use as a spend down so LTC Medicaid not used till they become impoverished again (if that even happens) plus if Medicaid paid anything it may possibly be repaid from Act of Sale $.
HOWEVER you plan on having your mom continue to keep her home, right? Because you feel you qualify for an exemption or exclusion to estate recovery, right? or it’s this due to a Lady Bird / Enhanced Benefit deed?
whatever it is, as a very 1st in all this is value of her home under whatever her State has set as the allowable value for a retained home?
Some have it at 500K, some 600K and CA has no asset limit. With property values being what they are, a lot of elders have homes that far exceed the allowable….. so cannot be retained.
B4 this goes too too far, find this out.
Home has a mortgage, right?
so as it has a mortgage, has pretty strict requirements as to having to have hazard insurance- homeowners, flood, windstorm- etc till that mortgage is paid off. Make sure u on your own can afford these for an undetermined period of time. Where I am - Louisiana- our insurance is crazy high with underwriters fleeing. Like if roof is over 10 years old, no underwriting but for the State insurer of last resort and its rates are egregious. I’d suggest that you budget as a minimum for 4 years of paying 100% on all costs plus 3K for attorney + emergency fund. As avg time in a NH is 2.5 years + allow 2 years to deal with estate recovery & perhaps open probate. Plus your own living expenses. So your wallet good on this??
Your mom has a homestead exemption. U really need to continue to keep that. Taxes lower. LTC Medicaid will have separate paperwork as to this done each & every year. It’s a “right of return” document. Assessor may also.
I’ll do another post on keeping house issues later.
I believe that it's everyone's best interests for mom's mortgage to be current.
I would discontinue credit card payments, as they are unsecured debt.
Have you consulted with a Medicaid Planner or Elder Law attorney in the matter of applying for Medicaid? That's probably your best course of action.
With regard to "keeping the house from Medicaid", if you are eligible for the caretaker exemption, you are going to need to be able to pay all the expenses related to the house from your own money--mortgage, utilities and insurance--because ALL of mom's income, if she is on LTC Medicaid, will go to the facility.