If she doesn’t want to see a Chaplin, why would you go against her wishes? If the rest of the family needs comfort and to speak to a member of clergy, I would arrange for it to be done without your aunts presence.
I cannot believe you would want to go against her wishes at the end of her life. I am an atheist all my life; while I don't mind a friendly face stopping by, and have no problem whatsoever with my friends who DO believe, this is personal to me, in that I seem simply to be born without the slightest gene for belief. I would find it so offensive if someone did an override on my wishes just because I was finally helpless enough they could do so.
Why go against her wishes? It is part of HER exit plan, I would honor her wish. The day before my cousin died he told me to give one of his cars to a certain friend, another to another and some $$$ to two other friends, It was verbal, not in his will, I did it honored his wishes.
Is seems a bit that the desire for the Chaplain is for yourselves. There is no shame with your aunt's wishes and honoring them shows self respect for this on your part.
Okay so I haven't gone against her wishes ! Just making sure I'm doing the right thing ! My husband said the same exact thing as all of you !! But although my parents included religion in raising us ...we did not become members of church ,or attend on a regular basis to any church ,so that being said I just want advice that I'm not doing something wrong like sacrileges !! I know I sound dumb !!but I really am un knowing about this !!!All I want is for her to be peaceful and comfortable the poor little frail woman I thought maybe she'd find comfort with a chaplin ....
Hold on a minute. Your Aunt in a Minister? That puts the whole debate in different light, don’t ya think?
My Father was a Minister. That would be so very very out of character for him - we would questioned it too - and likely would have brought his Pastor in anyway.
My FIL declined a 'chaplain' assigned to the hospital over and over. He was a member of a church with a very organized hierarchy, and the people 'in charge' visited him regularly and it really probably didn't occur to him that's who they were. (He was by no means active in the faith)
He passed quietly and with no drama in the hospital. DH, BIL, SIL and I were all there. We had a few quiet private moments with him after his passing, DH gave a short prayer and we were done. Dad always fell bad he never got to visit Spain, so before he died, I whispered in his ear "dad, ask whomever comes to get you to see if you can take a quick 'flyover' Spain".
We were all at peace. If your aunt does not want any religious fuss made, respect that. She might be mighty surprised to see what lies on the other side of this door we call Earth. I think we all will be,
Pray for yourself for strength and courage. God makes all things right.
Wow that's a tough one. For me I wouldn't go against her wishes, She's comfortable with herself to walk with god on her own. May god bless you and your family at this time.
She is a reverend herself but lives thousand miles away from any churches she was involved with ....before she got Alzheimer's she also taught in a religious college, also thousand miles away ....so you see I just thought maybe at this time of decline a nice chaplin would give her some comfort she was immediately turned off by the hospice Chaplin...so maybe I worded my 1st comment wrong I think she may like a chaplin visiting but not that one in particular
That’s different then. Maybe it is just that one. Find one if you like and tell them about your aunt. See if you think they will gel with her. In other words, check them out first for her. Hugs!
You could ask her if she's like to see someone of her faith - can you contact people from her old community to see if there is anyone affiliated with her church that may live in your area?
Lorraine dear, honestly no one is attacking you , just asking why you are asking this.... so calm down with the explanation marks. We are naturally curious why you asked since it was obvious she didn’t want to see one. Now you’ve explained the situation it makes more sense. What was striking to me as my dad's dementia developed and his natural cynicism and pessimism became worse, he claimed he didn’t believe anymore. Ok fine...whatever he thought was his to think. Once I brought communion to him on a Sunday (not Eucharist) and he didn’t even understand or know what communion was anymore. Surprised me since his past memories are the strong ones. So I said ok. I just let him be. i would ask her if there is someone from her past she wants to talk to. Even though she is a reverend, her thoughts on death and God don’t always need to be discussed with a person of "the cloth" so to speak. She may be fine with what she knows and feels in her relationship with God.
Sweetie, you have done the best you can. Don't let any comments said upset you. You have offered. She declined and has probably talked to God in her own way. I suggest that you do as she asked And find peace in that you have done the best that you can.
Not sure why sub comments under responses aren't available here so I'm just commenting generally but more in response to your last elaboration on the big picture Lorraine12; as a reverend herself she obviously has a very personal relationship with her faith and feels secure in that. I think your instinct about her lack of connection or affinity to the Hospice Chaplin is probably right on point and good for her for not tainting her own peace with her beliefs by putting up with someone she didn't feel connected to in that way, the simplest way to protect her bond with faith in this case is to refuse to see this person. If I were in your position I think I would ask her if there is anyone she would like to see, offer to contact someone for her and if she doesn't ask for a Reverend or faith based representative leave it be. Your attentiveness to this part of her life and desire to understand what might be helpful given your own life experience with faith is so special and so tremendously loving that there is no question in my mind that your aunt feels surrounded by love and that is all connected to her sense of faith. "Last rights" is not a part of every faith and often a persons need to see a priest, Chaplin, pastor just before they pass has more to do with their need to reconnect or feel connected and sometimes "unload" but it sounds to me as though your aunt feels right with her faith and feels her spirit connected to her God she doesn't need someone's help with that and what a perfect place to be, she sounds at peace with her passing. You should take great solace in that and be happy basking in her energy right now and your connection, love, with her. It's a very special thing, both your concern and awareness and her seeming peace, your family is very fortunate.
I do not think you should go against her wishes. People have a right to practice religion or not to, and that is an individual choice. It is part of Freedom of Religion. They have a right to believe what they want even if you disagree or even if what they believe is illogical to others. Even if the person is a family member.
There are subtle differences between churches and denominations that someone trained as clergy would understand.
...and some differences are NOT very subtle. It's possible this hospice chaplain is of a religious group that is very different from that of the aunt, and she recognizes this.
Lorraine: you don't sound dumb at all. We understand your point now. Sounds to me like you needed some comfort for yourself in that you did the right thing for her during a difficult time. Be good to yourself. *hug*
If she is still able to express her wishes, I would just ask her if there is anyone she would like to talk from her old church or any church. Let her decide what she wants and then do your best to accommodate. If she is at the point where she can no longer express herself, let it be.
If she doesn’t want it, I’d let it go. It’s not really going to change her situation as far as her health is concerned. Maybe you could see the chaplain separately and pray for her? You are honoring her wishes.
I learned as a child, that in an emergency....case of imminent death, anyone can perform the rite of baptism. Your LO has been baptized. God knows their heart & soul vs their disease. Trust that and be at peace
If she does NOT want to see the chaplain, then you should not force this upon her. Why would you ask to send for the chaplain when she has expressed her desire NOT to have one?
Your Aunt might not (1) share your belief system or (2) feel no need for the chaplain. Both of those are her choices.
Yes my Aunt is a Reverend but ....in her past she was almost a recluse my aunt never barely reached out to any of the family although I went to visit and called often ,I also wrote numerous letters she never really reached out back to us so I did not know her at this time in her life,I always felt a connection but My Aunt. But she was and is a VERY VERY PRIVATE PERSON she told her friends that I have met that she had NO FAMILY ...she even went so far as to hide all our family pictures in case someone were to visit her.So I am conflicted and did not know any answer .SORRY FOR ALL THE EXCLAMATION POINTS .I am so scared to make wrong choices since it is for another persons life I THANK GOD FOR ALL OF YOU! AND YOUR WISDOM and ADVICE! I really feel a bit better I think I may go to another church and ask for somebody to visit her just to visit not for anything like last rights but it would be nice for her to have more company anyhow I think that would be okay? I just don't know...THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR SUPPORT AND THE HUGS THE PRAYERS EVERYTHING THANK YOU THANK GOD FOR THIS SITE
You are imposing your wishes on her - please don't, let her choose who she sees. Were I to be her I would be very upset and distressed that someone else thought I should do as they wanted.
My Father was a Minister. That would be so very very out of character for him - we would questioned it too - and likely would have brought his Pastor in anyway.
He passed quietly and with no drama in the hospital. DH, BIL, SIL and I were all there. We had a few quiet private moments with him after his passing, DH gave a short prayer and we were done. Dad always fell bad he never got to visit Spain, so before he died, I whispered in his ear "dad, ask whomever comes to get you to see if you can take a quick 'flyover' Spain".
We were all at peace. If your aunt does not want any religious fuss made, respect that. She might be mighty surprised to see what lies on the other side of this door we call Earth. I think we all will be,
Pray for yourself for strength and courage. God makes all things right.
What was striking to me as my dad's dementia developed and his natural cynicism and pessimism became worse, he claimed he didn’t believe anymore. Ok fine...whatever he thought was his to think. Once I brought communion to him on a Sunday (not Eucharist) and he didn’t even understand or know what communion was anymore. Surprised me since his past memories are the strong ones. So I said ok. I just let him be.
i would ask her if there is someone from her past she wants to talk to. Even though she is a reverend, her thoughts on death and God don’t always need to be discussed with a person of "the cloth" so to speak. She may be fine with what she knows and feels in her relationship with God.
There are subtle differences between churches and denominations that someone trained as clergy would understand.
Maybe you could see the chaplain separately and pray for her? You are honoring her wishes.
Your Aunt might not (1) share your belief system or (2) feel no need for the chaplain. Both of those are her choices.