There has got to be a book! To protect others from a narcissist.

1) "Why would I do that?"
2)  "I never said that".
3)  "That is just your imagination".

Very limited contact works for me. Also having an escape route. I always have my own vehicle (never get a ride to visit) so I can leave at any moment.

Very firm boundaries are needed.

If I had a child who was a narcissist I would continue a relationship with them, but parents, siblings or other family members, nope. My well being is far more important that being a verbal punching bag to someone who does care at all for me.

My two sisters (both narcs, oh, yay) accused me of elder abuse and mishandling Mom's money a few days after Mom died a couple weeks ago. Their accusing was so bad I wondered if I needed a lawyer and then worried I'd be arrested. They refused to listen to me and would interrupt and contradict me--when they didn't even know the facts!

They had been to Lawyer (Sister 1 twice and Sister 2 once) and discussed Mom's finances, but not once did either of them or the lawyer ask me to attend. The lawyer studied a printout of Mom's checking and flagged potential abuse and fraud. Finally, Lawyer gave S2 a list of questions to ask and verify the rationale and receipts (which I had it all). S2 told S1 that she was satisfied all was well. S1 actually seemed disappointed. Not one sister apologized for putting me through hell right after Mom died.

Months ago when we were at first all doing great together, Sister 3, who had my successor trusteeship shared my promissory note between me and Mom with Sister 1, who told Sister 2. (I had previously asked S1 and S2 if they wanted their own copy of that document, but they declined.) Then they screamed at me for the financial decision I made -- which I maintain to this day was a good decision and would defend it in front of jury. Ever since that first incident they acted like I'm not even around.

In handling them, I've learned to give them the barest of information. I do not try to engage with them. I do not share any feelings or thoughts with them. They won't listen anyway or will interrupt and contradict me. They make accusations that are bizarre and come out of NOWHERE and I'm stunned into silence.

All I know is I CANNOT wait to leave here at the end of the month and go home. I don't intend to see any sister ever again.

Sorry MountainMoose.
I know others in your situation.

Many votes for going "No contact", I understand.

I understand that there is a Psychology Today about people with NPD and how to deal with them. But those three lines sound a bit more like Bordeline Personality Disorder to me. I'm no expert, just sounds like someone a little less in touch with reality.

Send are you talking about hubby? Aspy right? That is part of it I’m afraid. I’ve been known to record conversations with my son with autism and narcs just ignore truth lots of times. Notes, and be prepared for disbelief. I’m not sure with autism in the mix that they understand difference...

Thank you Guest!
I have been in disbelief for quite some time now. Trying to screw my head around what people are saying to me. Well, it just cannot be them, I am thinking.  And it is not just my husband.
So, I ask myself: What is wrong with me that I so often share way too much, giving them an open opportunity to critique whatever I do or say or feel? The aspy thing is similar, a total lack of empathy, yes, and conversations that go nowhere.
Then, an aspy can also lie, drink, gaslight, whatever a sociopath might do.

Not just throwing around terms here. Maybe he was misdiagnosed, but aspy doesn't quite cover it for me.

There will be no consoling me for being so stupid.

Barb,
It is often a thought, uh oh, here comes another hair-brained scheme, and if I don't agree, I do not exist any longer.  You are possibly not wrong.  Magical thinking exists in several family members.

But I need to take a step back, and read with detachment, what others are having success with, in identifying how not to be exploited.  Like, what do narcs say that stand out as different than the general population.  I have been told by acquaintances, that I am a soft touch, an easy mark, etc.

I am in therapy, and the advice is:  no contact.  Is that all they can suggest?  Less contact, armor and boundaries up?

Read more online, went to Psychology Today.

Way lots of information there. I think that I need to see a lawyer. I just read on another thread how important it is to protect finances from someone with cognitive issues.
I am at that scary point now.

Send ((((((hugs))))))). I had a friend years at whose grandma would always say to her daughter's and granddaughters " a woman should always have her own money in case she needs to pack up her tent and flee".
I'm sure it sounded better in the original language, but it's good advice. I tell people that my husband and I are married, but our money is not.

Barb,
Thank you for that advice.
Very much appreciated!

Sendhelp,

Do an online search of "What Makes Narcissists Tick: Understanding Narcissistic Personality Disorder" by Kathy Krajco and you will find a link for a free download of the book. Also recommended is "Disarming the Narcissist" by Wendy T. Behary.

There is no "one way" to deal with narcissists. My way was to go "low contact," which has so far worked well for me. I would go "no contact" if circumstances allowed.

You cannot change narcissists, period. But you can change yourself.

Sendhelp,

I forgot to add if you're dealing with a narcissist with dementia, you have double trouble because the narcissistic behavior only gets worse. In which case I recommend
"Coping With Your Difficult Older Parent, A Guide for Stressed Out Children" by Grace Lebow and Barbara Kane," which might be a more appropriate guide. This book actually suggests verbal responses a caregiver might use to counter the demands of those with dementia.

Thanks Can't Dance!
It is not dH who said those things above, but seems there are several who act this way, and set me into a fog trying to figure out my response. At first, I thought if I came across as tough as nails, they would back away. But I was judged. OK then.

Here is a two day conversation:
Me: Do we have any weed block fabric.?
dH: Yes.
Me: Where is it?
dH: I think we don't have any.
Shopping for same, this is much more than I thought.
Yesterday:
Me: We can go get some cheaper at Walmart.
dH: I think we do have some......why are you screaming?

There is nothing good for breakfast, so he is going with me, looking for weed block. I bribe him with in n out.

Send I'm confused. Do you mean when you are "tough as nails" with folks Other than DH, you are "judged"?

That's what narcissists do. They are always right and you are always wrong.

Just being tough with them doesn't make them nicer. It makes them angry and spiteful and hurtful.

That's why people go no contact or limit their contact sharply.

I vote "no contact". Reason is that narcs don't change - ever. These people are takers. Going "low contact" is never enough for them and they'll always make waves to get more. It's not workable and you end up sacrificing your own well being. Choose yourself.

Okay!
Seeing some more now, understanding better.

And, dH found the weed block.

SendHelp--

Those 3 short sentences hit me like a ton of bricks---I was sitting here thinking "She KNOWS my MIL!!"

After 41+ years of marriage, I am almost 100% "no contact" with my MIL. No reasoning with her, she's a sad miserable person.

She made a huge faux pas last summer, when at a family party, she lit into me as if it were just the two of us sitting alone. THE ENTIRE FAMILY heard the nasty, nasty things she said to me. My sweet niece said "Grandma! For heaven's sake, stop talking!"

I was upset and hurt--BUT, she waved the flag of her true colors in front of about 30 witnesses. Even my Dh had to admit that yeah, maybe she wasn't 'always nice' to me.

Small 'victory', but in reality--with a true Narc. personality, there is NO winning. Just survival.



On the drive home, DH asked me, in a small voice: "If you had known my mother was like she is before you married me, would you still have married me". To which I replied, "No. I wouldn't have." He was silent the rest of the ride home.



All it would have taken was him ONE TIME sticking up for me. He never has and never will. So I have no contact with her. Sad, really.

Yes, that too GingerMay! They are takers.

Yes, Midkid! I have known that "she lit into me", out of the blue, right? And, in front of friends. So, this thread is all about those things narcissist do and say. Your granddaughter said the right thing, I think: "Grandma, stop talking!".

I have known so many, mostly women, who do this "lit into me" thing. And wondered.
Tried to look it up. I thought they were having blips on their radar, or some kind of epilepsy, or even PMS, or Menopause. Maybe a neurologist should study their brains.

This thread hits home. Just posting a few things my sister has said to me that should have been "red flags" for going no-contact much earlier:
1) "If I did anything to hurt you I'm sorry" ... after you explained exactly what the offending behavior was and they're clearly not going to own it or do anything to ease your hurt.
2) "I'm fine with everything, you're the one who's always upset about something" ... after they do one more thing that shows utter disregard for you.
3) "Let me know when you're over it" ... belittling your pain and wanting notice for when they can strike again.

"I've done the very best I could. With your father disabled, we were just getting by." When there was active abuse and neglect, as well as hoarding 2/3 of the SSA payments.

Oh no. Not going to follow this thread. I've made myself mad.

Surprise,
Thank you, and good effort sharing!
Learning about narcissists can make one very uncomfortable, and even ill.

Everyone should limit their exposure to not only the narcissist, but also limit exposure to this topic. Growth comes slowly. Re-visiting the trauma caused, may best be done in therapy. I don't know. But very big hugs for sharing!!! I don't blame you if you don't want to come back to this topic. It is painful (not for the narcissist, but for the targeted caregivers.)

Hugs, and P.M. me if you don't feel better. Others have been so kind to also reach out as I was/ I am / suffering to rise above this mess.

They must have a special radar for when the target is getting ready to limit contact.

The call for help comes in, desperate like.

I have always wondered about the word Narcissist. I have even read up on the subject years ago.

I have even wondered if the word applied to my Mother after joining this forum. I really don’t think so. I think there was something else going on there.

But, sitting, reflecting on the last couple of months and some events happening around me, I am again wondering about this word Narcissist.

I have had this gut feeling that I am going to get a call from a person in DHs family.

The family is going thru a situation that has them split down the middle.

Half of the siblings trying to be reasonable about the situation. The other half, cowering in fear as I see it, afraid of what this person is demanding, threatening, it really is quite unreal.

This person my gut tells me might call me.

This person certainly feels entitled, has no empathy, has a clear air about them or tries to project it anyway that they are way smarter, successful, just plain better than their siblings.

Yikes, might my gut be telling me I am not only going to be getting a call but a call from a Narcissist?!?

When I started having this feeling I thought maybe this person might want an unbiased opinion. Now, I don’t think that is the case.

Maybe this person sees me as an “easy mark” as referenced above. I surely hope that is not the case.

I guess, I can proceed as I usually do with anyone and a difficult situation. Slowly. If things erupt on their part, I guess I will have my answer.

There have been discussions amongst the reasonable siblings...what is she thinking? Can she not see she is destroying the family? Is she showing signs of Dementia?

There are clear signs her executive function is lacking if she ever had much of one.

I am stumped...

There was a call made. Not to me. The call was to our 23yr old nephew. Obviously the “easy mark”.

There has to be a book! And I need it tomorrow!!!

Lizzy,
If it will help, we are listening.

Thanks Send,

Sorry about the novel I posted above. Just thinking as I typed I guess.

Possibly over analyzing things like hubby says I tend to do. But it’s just me.

It’s an estate thing. One of the Executors has gone off the rails, literally, IMO. The second Co Executor, IMO, will not stand up to the other Co Executor. This whole situation is turning into a firestorm. I can’t for the life of me figure out what is driving this person. She has been “fired” by two attorneys and is on her third trying to get her agenda met.

I for the life of me can’t figure this person out.

She’s in her early 60s. She’s not one of the siblings that I am around enough to call this Dementia. If Narcissists refuse to acknowledge they are wrong, fly off the handle trying to argue an irrational agenda, lie, uggh, the list goes on. Maybe she is a Narcissist.

She’s definitely not stable!

Drugs, alcohol, Dementia, I have a good handle on those things. This situation is just different. I don’t know what box to put this person in.

There are caregivers who know about this. So sorry Lizzy, that you are anywhere close to this. Being fired by 2 attorneys is a red flag.

These situations can get so terribly ugly, can't they? Mine very similar to MountainMoose. Even with a conservator ordered by the court to audit mom's accounts and spending, the twisted narc sisters still did not believe that I was not financially exploiting.

You got it...ugly, and fast. Not fast when you look at the big picture. It got ugly one year ago when she started throwing the $1 clause around stated in the Will should anyone Contest or try to Invalidate the Will.

No one is or has contested or questioned the Will. She has taken the Will on an off road adventure.

Send, how are you doing? How’s your situation?