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It seems that America is becoming very hateful. It's concerning because there are a lot of ill people who need care and support.
Maybe its just things getting worse before better.

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Shell, I agree with everything you said. And I do think that trump has absolutely added fuel to the fire. But I don’t think he’s responsible for all these school shootings.

I think what has always bothered me is that.....gun violence hasn’t been an issue until schools started getting shot up. Gun violence has been a problem since at least the 1980s in places like California, NY, Chicago, Baltimore. A few years ago my city had the highest youth murder rate per capita, in the Nation! And how do you think they were being killed? By guns! Cities like LA and Oakland historically have had hundreds, even thousands of gun-related deaths per year. Many CHILDREN have died by gun violence every year. And no one care, it wasn’t front page news until now. Seems like no one cared when it was gangs shooting each other.....people act like we just now have a gun problem but the truth is, it’s been a problem for decades.

We are definitely living in different times. Different economy. My parents first house was 1200 sq ft and they paid $66k for it in 1978. They sold it for $155k in 1994. They bought a brand new 2100sq ft house for $210K that same year. Minimum wage around that time was $5.25 an hour! They sold that house in 2004 for 615k! Minimum wage was $8 an hour. Wages have not really gone up much but the cost of living sure has. California minimum wage is $12 now. I have been trying to go back to work but finding it difficult because of my husbands job and the low wages. After the affordable care act went in to effect, employers decided to hire part time workers Instead of full time so they wouldn’t have to provide insurance! So all I was seeing was jobs working 25-30 hours a week, then they wanted a 4 year degree and pay was minimum wage! I have the degree but it makes no sense to work for minimum wage when you have to pay for child care. Why would I go back to work & earn $1600 a month when child care for 2 kids would cost me $1200? I rarely see job postings that offer more than $15 an hour. Usually it’s $12-$15 an hour and a 4 year degree required.

I think social media has also played a huge part in things. People have a voice now. New gets out faster. We hear about more things because it’s easy to share it on social media.

and yes parents are no longer parenting their kids. They would rather be their kids friend! Now we are supposed to “respect” our kids and let them have a say in everything and treat them like our equals! I’m not saying I disrespect my kids because I don’t but we have a hierarchy in this family and for good reason. I let my kids have input but at the end of the day, I am the decision maker. I already see it with my daughters friends....all very good kids but some have parents that have a different parenting style and my daughter gets mad because her friends don’t have bed times, they can wear makeup and go all over town with an adult present and we just don’t parent that way. I am always the bad guy these days because I don’t let her do all of the things her friends can do.
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My point is that maybe it isn't just one thing causing mass shooting but a lot of things combine!


Send,

I think you have a great point to go along with everything else that I have pointed out. People are becoming more secular, perhaps picking things over God and their fellow-man!

God has a plan!
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As America becomes more and more secular, and God's people turn away from prayer, there will be hate. It may appear that this is the end, but it is an opportunity for miracles when God shows up to save His people.

Everyone can pray to God, and he will hear your prayers, even if you are not a believer.
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I'm going to put my little 2 cents in, this is what I think why we see so many big shootings: Worried would be correct on that we had school shootings back when Bill Clinton was present, so why so many now?

Here is what I see in my small part of the world...1) more people have to work 2 to 3 jobs just to keep a roof over their heads. Housing cost is at an all time high. At one time whether you rent or was buying a home it shouldn't have cost more than 28% of your income...then it went to 38% and now it is 42%. Remember this is average or medium! Then lets add the wonderful corporations. I am sorry to say their greed is killing us as everyday people and us as a country. Most people on ground level including managers are not making the money that our parents and even some of us use to make. A person with a degree or without a degree are finding themselves has to work 2 jobs because they are not getting the hrs--little along, any benefits. Take Targets for example you start out in my city at 13.50 hr which isn't bad but you only get 15 to 20 hrs plus, you do the job for 3 people. H3ll, the guys that install my new furnace was only making $15.00 hr. When in the 80's & 90's they use to make $25 to $30 hr. Some of the big manufactures use to start out at $18 to $22 hr plus benefits not any more, around here, they are starting out at $10 hr with very little benefits. No one can live on that. Then you have companies that get rid of employees that are close to retirement before the employee retires, therefore, whose people have to go out looking for a job because they can't afford to retire yet. A full work week is not so much 40 hrs as it once was!

So if both parents are working all the time and feeling the pressure of trying to keep food on the table and a roof over their heads...then isn't the kids feeling the pressure as well?

2)Then you have social media which is great when it is used properly. But there is a whole generation that used texting, internet, and what-not that they really didn't have to learn to look people in eye or just learned social ques. They learned that you can break-up with someone without even seeing the hurt they cause. Kids learned they can bully without seeing the pain on their fellow human faces and the affects of their actions. I am not against our technology but maybe my Bishop has a point "with technology so in- graded in our lives that we are forgetting how to be human."

3) We have more people who are self-entitled, full-of-themselves (know about everything and you can't teach them because they know it all).

4) Parents not teaching their kids the way we were taught. What I mean is parenting has become a noun and they forgot the verb in parenting. I might piss-off some people but when did kids tell the parent what to do? I see this all the time! My sig other and I went to an RV show this pass weekend and I couldn't believe that kids were telling the parent what camper they liked or didn't like and the parent went along with the kid?! (The tail waging the dog)! I work with the pubic and I hear kids telling their parent we are getting this or that and I also hear the kids calling parents names like "your dumb dad" or "mom your so stupid," if I would have said these things to my parents I probably still be picking myself off the floor! LOL! My dad never hit me, but I think he would have smack my butt for talking that way!

I don't care for Trump, but I don't think he is the cause for mass shootings. However, he does have "this racist undertone to him."

I read somewhere can't remember the article but it stated that "the Whitehouse and this country has never been divided as it has been with Trump".

The government wants us to believe that unemployment rate is going down, but what they don't tell you is the only people that are counted are the ones who collect unemployment or are actively looking for work but in "2018 it was reported that over one million people gave up looking for a job" 20/20 reporte
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Needhelp, I don’t think school shootings became “common” if we want to call them that....until the late 90s. I graduated in 1999. Bill Clinton was president when the columbine shooting took place and I can recall there were several small school shooting when I was in high school.
a few years before I started high school, there was a shooting there—my US history teacher was shot by a student in his classroom. When I started school there, he always wore a fanny pack and it was rumored he carried a gun in it for protection! Of course in today’s world.....there would be so much outrage if a teacher brought a gun to school! But back then....no one thought much of it because after all, the poor teacher had been shot a few years earlier!!
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Cali,

I am in my 60’s. The worst in my school days were ‘fake’ bomb threats made by a student because they didn’t study for a test. I feel so sorry for kids today that have anxiety about possible school shootings. So sad.

The most I saw as far as violence was two kids fighting in the school parking lot.

Kids got suspended or expelled occasionally. Two girls got caught smoking in the bathroom.

Never would I have dreamed of someone entering a school and shooting staff and students.

It entered my mind as a teacher. I feel for all school employees and students. It’s mind boggling.
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all thing things happen now were happening when Obama was in office.
lets not forget about media influence. They sensationalize certain topics, they pick and choose what to make an issue of. But if you all want to pretend none of this was happening until trump took office, go ahead.
i’m not a trump supporter but I also don’t have my heads in the clouds.
there were hate crimes and school shootings happening even before Obama was in office. But everyone wants to blame trump....
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EssieMarie, I completely agree with you.   Violence condoned can encourage unstable people to become emboldened.
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I see much more violence occurring now particularly regarding gun violence. How many more shootings will we see in schools, large scale events, churches, etc. I am going to cut to the chase and blame our current president for giving these hate groups permission to come out of the closet. I don't recall ever seeing so much hatred and violence before this president. He mocks persons who have disabilities, curses on national television during his ridiculous rallies. White supremacy and neo nazis holding conventions and demonstrating. Remember the Charlottsville incident. Until we elect a kinder more humane president, I believe we will continue to see escalating violence.
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Karsten, this might be the movie thread to which you referred:

https://www.agingcare.com/discussions/anyone-seen-any-good-movies-lately-455475.htm

I think some examples of people who are good, caring people are those who help out homeless and other disadvantaged populations, not only before the holidays but throughout the year.  Others are those, especially the Veterans, who extend themselves to help fellow Vets, including the one (and possibly a second one if memory serves me correctly) who was walking cross country to raise awareness of the needs of Veterans.

And there are the first responders, who put their lives on the line, as well as medical and educational people, who probably make far less than they could if they entered highly paid fields.    And they often have to put up with a lot from patients or school children and their parents.

But from what I've seen, the people in the helping categories don't have the same motivations as those who become venture capitalists, stockbrokers, or other generally high paying fields.   That's not necessarily a criticism, more of an observation.   Some people have a real need to help others.  Some have higher motives to help themselves.

And some blend both motives and extend to others.   I've read negative comments here and there about the big banks, but I wonder how many people know that 3 of them help the 4 categories of populations that I mentioned.

FWIW, earlier last year when I started working on my father's house (with a large lot and lake privileges),  I had (and still have) a strong determination to offer it first to the first to those in helping professions.   After a lot of calls, research, and more, I finally connected with the HUD rep who handles these kinds of donations.

But the houses aren't donated by owners; they're donated by Chase, BAC and Wells Fargo (at that time).   Foreclosed houses are donated, fixed up by HUD (if I remember correctly), then donated, for free, to Veterans, law enforcement, medical and then educational personnel, in that order.  That's my understanding of how the HUD program operates.

The realtor with whom I discussed this issue also sells houses on those priority levels; the houses aren't available to the general public until the 4 categories have had opportunities to purchase.

Those kinds of more or less hidden extensions of good will don't seem to be well known, but I wish they were.   


I remember how many people offered just simple help when my father was alive...help with lawn mowing, snow removal, food, paying for meals, and more.    And they would never accept any reward or compensation.

The negativity that's existent in the US and in other countries seems to offset that, and it probably does gather more media attention than good works.  Perhaps that's b/c it's more sensational, but also b/c it's destabilizing and people need to be aware that there are some pretty nasty, racist and unstable people out there.
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There was a thread on favorite movies. One of mine was Love, Actually.

In the beginning, Hugh Grant talks about how people say the world is becoming a hateful place, but when he looks around him he doesn't see that. There are then (real) scenes of people meeting up at the airport with all the hugs and joy.

In the same way, while we can always looks around and see acts of hate, I think that has always been the case but overall I think most people are good and caring.
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NY DIL, love your comment about cursive writing.  I assume you're aware of how many people admit they can't write in cursive any more, which I assume is b/c of the abbreviations and drift from good English to abbreviations or what I consider nonsense language?  

I wonder if, thousands if not millions of years from now, a new or evolved civilization will find all the tech gadgets, or read something like the " u r " bastardization of English, and create a discipline to study the "old languages" to decipher them.   English and written languages may have disappeared by then, but hopefully there will still be people who can write and spell.  

In their place, people with hand, wrist and arm injuries may have evolved.   Some years ago when I tore a rotator cuff, the arm and hand specialist I consulted said that he was treating an increased level of young women with injuries reflective of intense texting.  

Maybe we should create a Rosetta Stone for our far distance future humans.
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Oh how I miss back in the day! Makes me think about a funny and true meme I saw not long ago:

"I can't wait until I'm in a nursing home. I'm going to write bathroom graffiti about the staff they can't understand because it's in cursive."
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FreqFlyer, you got it - page hits.   If you don't change your home page, you're bombarded with articles, and ads.    And they're often trashy ads.   

But the comments on articles - whew!   You need a shield to protect yourself from all the hostile attacks and the foul language.     I think these are sites where people can publicly but anonymously descend to the lowest levels of writing.
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Another thing I have noticed that some on-line news article will allow "comments" at the bottom of the article. The comments are over the top. Makes me wonder why those new services even allow this. Ok, I know why, more "hits" on the articles help with advertising showing how many more people read this news service.

Back in the day, if someone had a comment they wrote a "Letter to the Editor" and mailed it to the newspaper.
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Hey Garden,

I hear you. By the way, no political argument from me. I’m right in the middle! Hahaha I am not democrat or republican. I am registered as an independent. I don’t like extremes in any direction.

Seriously though, some issues should be respected by both parties. I agree with your post.
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Cali,

They were ticked off! His dad is an attorney. Hahaha 😂

Sorry, I shouldn’t laugh but when his mom told me about it was crazy. It was his dad’s new car that he took.

His dad is such a nice guy. Both mom and dad are very involved in the community. Great couple. He’s the only boy. He has two sisters. Guess he was trying to be macho or something.
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OMG that is quite a wild hair to get!!! I bet his parents were HPT when they saw it too! And that’s exactly what I mean. Kids sneak out and it can happen so fast! One woman in the comments is up on her high horse saying she checks on her kids multiple times a night and therefore the parents of these kids must not be diligent enough! I want to tell her....your kids might be sneaking out 2 minutes after you last checked them & returning before you check them again!
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Cali,

Kids do sneak out after the parents are sleeping. My neighbors kid did that. He took the car and picked up a few friends, came back home before his parents were awake. They noticed a tattoo on his arm. Yep, he got a wild hair up his a** to go get a tattoo.
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GardenArtist, I know exactly what you mean. We really need more diplomatic people to be role models. We need a Mr. Roger's for adults.
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Shell, I like that saying and it’s very true! Common sense really isn’t so common.

This forum is great. Its a valuable resource and a great support system. This place is much tamer & the members much smarter and more pleasant than the folks in my local Facebook groups & the local news Facebook pages comments section. My gosh you have to be in a very good mood to be able to read the crap people post there! My city gets teased because we made a list of least educated cities in the country and every day I read the comments on FB and think to myself “you people really are proving that we belong on that list!”.

And I said earlier, the same people who complain f the police never doing anything are always the first (and loudest) to complain when the police do something or receive grants to pay for tools that will help fight crime! They are just never happy! What is really astounding me is that these people are always so quick to defend the parents when teenage gang members make the news-whether one was killed or arrested for murder or some other violent crime—people defend the parents by saying the kids join gangs because their parents have to work long hours to be able to afford to live in this state. Well now these same people are Losing their chit because a car full of teenagers, driven by a 15 year old crashed over the weekend and one of the kids died. They are demanding to know “where were the parents” “why were these kids out at midnight”. So many comments saying parents need to be more diligent! And I’m just thinking.....so my kid joins a gang and does something bad and I get a free pass because everyone assumes I’m a poor hard working mom. But my kid goes for a joyride and loses his life I’m a horrible parent who wasn’t diligent enough. Because it hasn’t occurred to anyone that perhaps the parents of these kids were at work? Or maybe these kids snuck out as soon as their parents went to bed and crashed shortly after? It’s maddening really. As I said on Dorkers thread meaning to post it elsewhere-years ago when my brother and cousin were 12 and 14, my brother spent the night at my uncles house. My uncle was deaf in one year thanks to childhood meningitis. As soon as he went to bed at midnight, my cousin (14) took his keys and they went for a joyride. They didn’t get far, within minutes my cousin who didn’t know the rules of the road, stopped at a red light and then decided he wanted to turn left so he backed up and changed lanes, in front of a cop and was promptly pulled over. They could have just as easily crashed the car in that amount of time. Sure my uncle could have hidden his keys but why? Neither of the boys had ever done anything like this. Anyway !
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One good aspect is that it's a place where emotionally unstable, potential and actual mass shooters share their manifestos, providing more data for law enforcement to monitor and hopefully identify before they go off the rails.   

Otherwise, I think personal interaction on forums of similar interests are better than mass interaction.    Just my opinion though.   

As to the future of this country, I don't think I've ever been more worried and concerned than I am now.    And since I don't want to provoke political arguments, I'll leave it at that.
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Hey Worried,

I had a friend years ago that said "Common Sense is a Superpower." I think this is very true in today's world.

Social media does really show how many sheltered or ignorant people there is in the world. I think social media has taught people how to be "not human." But on the flip side there are some good points to it--like this forum!
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Freqflyer, social media has given people a voice they didn’t previously have. But you are absolutely correctly that most people who act like keyboard thugs wouldn’t say those things to someone’s face!

For me, social media has shown me just how many sheltered people there are in this world. And how many lack common sense and are just plain ignorant.

I was reading comments on the “Nextdoor” app and there is a post about our local police dept getting a grant for license plate readers. Only purpose is to track down stolen vehicles (and stolen license plates) faster. Now the same people who complain that the cops aren’t going anything when they are the victim of a crime, are the same people throwing a fit about the license plate readers because they think are an invasion of privacy and a violation of the 4th amendment. i Have to limit how often I read the comments on social media because there are just so many stupid comments being posted.
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Ff,

Of course not! Like you, I am not on Facebook, Twitter or any other social media because people now just hide behind their screens and say what ever they think without any thought to what it may cause the person on the other side. No one has the balls to say what they think to anyone's face or even on the phone! They are gutless bullies!!!
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Thankfully I am not on Facebook, Twitter, and whatever other social media that gives instant replies. But I see on the news how hateful some of the messages can be. Really now, would these people call up the person and say those things directly voice to voice? It's like the maturity level has been driven down a few notches.
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This is what im worried about

https://www.toronto.com/news-story/9801009-family-outraged-by-swastika-drawn-on-uncle-s-head-at-toronto-care-facility/?fbclid=iwar11uzfryhebxnalfvlcvfdfbeqinguxgfjzlqt3p1hmmmffmtifw7t7uym
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National flags are flown, by the field workers, in the Ag fields where I live. The only flag you NEVER see them flying is the american flag. Been that way for years too, long before trump was elected. I mostly see Mexico’s flag being flown here.
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The Rose Parade had one American flag at the start of the parade.
Only one.
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So true. All these news channels slanting things different ways. It's hard to know what to believe, and we need to take some things with a grain of salt.

I think over time, people have become more respectful. The media would tell you otherwise 😉
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