To answer why is a nursing home/long term care so expensive we need to realize how many costs are involved in running such a facility. I know it won't make your bill seen sweeter, but it will give you some idea why the cost...
First thing is the cost of the land, zoning changes, building designers, land development such as the footprint for the building, parking, water and sewer, road construction, etc. all need before the building is even built. Back and forth to the County/City for approvals. The cost of the new building itself, which can easily run into the multi-multi-millions. Imagine paying the mortgage and insurance on that !!
The building needs to be Staffed, not only with 3 shifts of caregivers, nurses, Aides, but also with kitchen help, inside cleaning help daily, Administration, maintenance personal. Payroll is extremely expensive. Then add in payroll taxes, workman's comp, etc. Office computers, and telephone service. Alarm systems for fire and carbon monoxide. Don't forget the landscapers and winter plowing. Plus business licenses. And contracts with medical transporters, which are similar to ambulances, to take a patient to and from a medical appointment.
Now, lets look at the cost of the electric/gas bill, imagine what that would look like. Then the water bill must be over the top. Then there is furniture, hospital beds, special mattresses, cabinets for the rooms, hoya lifts, oxygen equipment, dining room furniture, nursing stations, WiFi. Then the cost of food for 3 meals per day with a lot of special diets. Let's not forget cost of bedding and towels. Oh, having meds and medical supplies on hand.
Here's a biggee, real estate tax on the building and land, and liability insurance in case someone gets hurt in the building.
Some places have on-staff physical therapy with a small gym and all the equipment for the gym. Or a place has a contract with a sub-contractor for physical therapy which is done in a patient's room.
It's becomes MORE expensive to become older. Note to the younger people here, start those "rainy day" savings accounts as someday it will be storming out there.
As someone said, in a hospital setting (and that's for a short stay and the person needs hospital attention, such as IV needs) Medicare covers 100%. My mother was admitted to the hospital on Sunday 2/4/18 from a nursing home, and was moved to palliative care 2/7, and I signed her into hospice (same room) the next day, 2/8. She died early Thursday 2/15. (her calling hours are tomorrow 2/19, and funeral the next day). I began 24/7 caregiving when dad had a stroke in 1994, and after his death in 2007 mom became very ill and I was her caregiver until she died. She went into a nursing home in October 2017. We were beginning to apply for Medicaid when she died because her assets were nearly gone; the nursing home was $270/day. So, mom managed to live long enough to spend all of her money and then she died. Isn't that what we say?! Point - check with an elder lawyer about your financial options - can you protect some assets? At some point Medicaid will take over. My mom was NOT wealthy.
Yes, it is about 12,000 per month here in LA. If hospitalized, one has from 30 days to 90 days care in a nursing home paid under Medicare. If not hospitalized, one has to pay the room cost themselves. How do people afford it? If anyone out there thinks out medical system is broken, consider that more cutbacks are being considered. After living in Europe, we are delusional about out medical care here in the US. Even the little we have has been fought tooth and nail. We cannot have better medical care for all without taxation. Period.
I recall one person (who was 80 y/o with a mother approaching 106 y/o) commenting on another thread that nursing home care in Canada is much more affordable than in the US. I wonder how much it costs and what causes it to be more affordable there. I have a prescription I get from Canada but obviously nursing care and various other medical expenses can't be ordered online from there.
DowntownLA, we are already taxed at higher rates than England or Canada and still do not have good medical care. The government needs to trim the fat and make employees accountable and productive then our taxes could go for helping the truly needy, not the truly lazy. When there are more government employees than private sector workers who pay for the government employees it is NOT sustainable, period. You can not tax people more until you are responsible for the taxes you already collect. Our city had the balls to justify bad streets saying what can they do, they have 500,000.00 for road work and 14 million to administrate that 500k. Are you kidding me, that is why are elderly eat f****ng cat food to get protein, they cant afford to live and eat, but government just keeps getting bigger, longer vacations, better benefits oh and by the way, they get to fund pensions not social security. Sorry more tax IS NOT THE ANSWER, RESPONSIBILTY AND ACCOUNTABILITY FOR OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY IS.
I've got mom on hospice care now, she is not swallowing, if she chews anything she spits it out and sometimes even hoards it in her mouth until i'm not looking then out it comes on her chest or down her chin. sometimes she even spits liquids out. she's skinny and not there most of the time, sleeping all day the past couple of days and not a bite at all lately. my sister thinks she should have a feeding tube, i don't see the point. anyway, about the hospice, we have home hospice, and i don't know if the shortage of people available for services is low here or it's standard, we get the nurse only once a week, a bed bath once a week, a chaplain (I feel like damien driving up to the church when she comes, haha), a 2 hour companion twice a week but that's actually inconvenient because of her hours, and a massage lady. she sleeps through most of it. but at least she is at home where my partner and i keep her clean, her bed, sit her up in the living room for the afternoon and evening or just evening depending on the day. and yes, her insurance and medicare pay for that. which leaves us able to have a visiting angel twice a week, at least to wash her if she's not awake. it's hard, hard watching her die, but i feel better and i think she does too, that we her family are here for her and not surrounded by strangers doing a job, even if some of them are very caring, i just can't see that it would be the same.
When my brother went to our local Hospice House, it was based on ability to pay. They had a reasonable daily room rate (I think it was about $150-175).
Gee, I am so glad I read these posts. I always thought that Medicare covered hospice stays in or out hospital. I thought people stayed at home to make it better for the patient and their family.
My mother went into Hospice Nov. 2017. As it was explained to me at the time, the hospice we chose was a *not-for-profit* so they took whatever Medicare would pay. Other than that, it exists solely on private donations. As they told us, 'No one is ever denied services from us, regardless of whether you can pay or not.' She was admitted into hospice status the entire time, which also made a difference. Sadly, mom went in knowing she wouldn't ever come home, but we didn't pay a dime for any of the 9 days that she was in and received absolutely tremendous, compassionate care from the staff 24/7. We neither received nor saw any bills... and having dealt with hospitals and bills for months previous, what a relief it was for somebody to take charge and literally say to us "Don't worry about a thing, just be with your mom." Also the day she was admitted, they delivered to the house everything she would need if she ever came home, including a lift chair and hospital bed.
Perhaps you should check around and look for a not-for-profit. I'm in Pennsylvania so I don't know if the laws are different for where you live, but it might be worth a few phone calls.
And more taxation is NOT the answer... how can it be in this great country, that people who can't or won't work oftentimes end up receiving better health care than veterans and people who have worked their entire lives? This is a fact... we all know people who have lived on welfare "forever" and lack for nothing when it comes to health care. I'm not begrudging them that, but don't we owe it to those that have shouldered the cost of keeping them to do likewise when they need it the most, instead of worrying about whether or not they might forced to sell everything they own to pay hospital bills? I'm no socialist, but sometimes I have to wonder if universal healthcare is the solution.
TekkieChikk--I feel much the same way. I also wonder if there isn't some way to bring down costs. In addition, I believe the health insurance system creates a lot of the problem because it collects a lot of money but provides no actual healthcare services, so costs are driven up, but once that is in place then the population is essentially "addicted" to it because there are generally no discounts for private pay. I believe another commenter said something to this effect on one of these threads during the past few days. A few years ago there was a very interesting article in The Atlantic magazine about this.
If the government is going to give free healthcare to professional welfare recipients some that are 3rd and 4th generation then they need to have facilities just for them, IMHO, but like Obama care they don't try to look at the entire picture when they put regulations into affect, if you say I'll only pay 8.00 to Dr for office visit and not say medical supply for profit you can't charge 4.00 for a tongue depresser (splg?) 3.00 for disposable thermometer and so on. They need to regulate the entire industry or leave it all alone. My husband and I pay more monthly for insurance then most people get in SS benefits. Broken beyond repair, they can not expect 20% of the population to pay for everyone. It is not sustainable and creates civil unrest, when I hear he only paid 34 million in taxes I boil. As a business owner you pay many more taxes than personal taxes. We should stop paying 30 something's disabity because they won't work or have fried their brains with drugs. I am concerned that at the rate our country is imploding that my grandbabies will have no choices but to live in extreme poverty with "big brother" dictating everything.
Sorry, I hope I have not offended anyone, it is all my opinion and as another poster said, opinions and butts, we all have one🤡
Biased in what way? I have friends that pay exorbitant premiums for insurance every month and have huge deductibles to meet before any care is even covered. Not eligible for a subsidy because she makes too much (less than $50k). So...per her, her premium is as much as her monthly mortgage. Is that fair? And yes, business taxes too are exorbitant; small business owners too are squeezed. This system is broken.
A not-for-profit is definitely the way to go; that's how it all started till somebody decided they could make one, but, yes, then they're going to just take Medicare, but if we're talking about an inpatient one, then those buildings still have to be paid for; yes, there are grants for maybe getting one started but they probably won't finish one, at least not one you'd want to stay in, but then if you want to not pay anything, maybe you shouldn't expect anything; now, not sure what the difference is in "putting people first" as you go and continuing to have a mortgage and paying off the building early by only taking people who can help you pay for it and of course don't know the situation but do know they do depend on private donations in order to do what they do, so...
Thank you Shane1124, yes our insurance premiums are 400.00 a month more than our mortgage was. And I have to pay 7500.00 in deductible before anything covered. So if being against the people that work hard and live under there means to be able to be self supporting being forced through taxes to pay for the people that find government freebies to beneficial to get out and work hard, then I guess my opinion is bias. I think that presidents like obama did there best to destroy the American dream, work hard, advance and have a nice life, now you just need to know how to fill out beggaforms from uncle Sam and you to can have a nice life without any effort at all. It's not sustainable, so then what, government confiscates or devalues the dollar so we to can be a thriving 3rd world country with all our kids going to bed hungry, unless mommy and daddy work for the government? Why do you think all the other nations get here anyway they can, because of the very thing i said. Maryfh, am I not entitled to my opinion, you are, you even felt entitled enough to judge my opinion. Glass houses you know!
First thing is the cost of the land, zoning changes, building designers, land development such as the footprint for the building, parking, water and sewer, road construction, etc. all need before the building is even built. Back and forth to the County/City for approvals. The cost of the new building itself, which can easily run into the multi-multi-millions. Imagine paying the mortgage and insurance on that !!
The building needs to be Staffed, not only with 3 shifts of caregivers, nurses, Aides, but also with kitchen help, inside cleaning help daily, Administration, maintenance personal. Payroll is extremely expensive. Then add in payroll taxes, workman's comp, etc. Office computers, and telephone service. Alarm systems for fire and carbon monoxide. Don't forget the landscapers and winter plowing. Plus business licenses. And contracts with medical transporters, which are similar to ambulances, to take a patient to and from a medical appointment.
Now, lets look at the cost of the electric/gas bill, imagine what that would look like. Then the water bill must be over the top. Then there is furniture, hospital beds, special mattresses, cabinets for the rooms, hoya lifts, oxygen equipment, dining room furniture, nursing stations, WiFi. Then the cost of food for 3 meals per day with a lot of special diets. Let's not forget cost of bedding and towels. Oh, having meds and medical supplies on hand.
Here's a biggee, real estate tax on the building and land, and liability insurance in case someone gets hurt in the building.
Some places have on-staff physical therapy with a small gym and all the equipment for the gym. Or a place has a contract with a sub-contractor for physical therapy which is done in a patient's room.
It's becomes MORE expensive to become older. Note to the younger people here, start those "rainy day" savings accounts as someday it will be storming out there.
How do people afford it? If anyone out there thinks out medical system is broken, consider that more cutbacks are being considered. After living in Europe, we are delusional about out medical care here in the US. Even the little we have has been fought tooth and nail. We cannot have better medical care for all without taxation. Period.
Perhaps you should check around and look for a not-for-profit. I'm in Pennsylvania so I don't know if the laws are different for where you live, but it might be worth a few phone calls.
And more taxation is NOT the answer... how can it be in this great country, that people who can't or won't work oftentimes end up receiving better health care than veterans and people who have worked their entire lives? This is a fact... we all know people who have lived on welfare "forever" and lack for nothing when it comes to health care. I'm not begrudging them that, but don't we owe it to those that have shouldered the cost of keeping them to do likewise when they need it the most, instead of worrying about whether or not they might forced to sell everything they own to pay hospital bills? I'm no socialist, but sometimes I have to wonder if universal healthcare is the solution.
Sorry, I hope I have not offended anyone, it is all my opinion and as another poster said, opinions and butts, we all have one🤡
This system is broken.
Maryfh, am I not entitled to my opinion, you are, you even felt entitled enough to judge my opinion. Glass houses you know!