My mom has been a miserable, nasty, and hateful person all her life. As a mother she has dominated every aspect of her children's life.

It's frustrating because people who I thought understand now don't seem to get it. Even my own sister. A week ago my mother had decided that me moving down to Arizona was not a good idea. That she would have to move up here. Not that I wanted that either but at least she was not trying to make me move there. But then my sister(who by the way can't stand our mother either) tells her that if I move down there and something happend to my mom that she or her husband would come get me! Gee THANKS. So now my mother has decided to push me once again to move there And my friend who seemed understanding in the beginning now doesn't seem to be. I don't know if she is tired of hearing me talk about it or what but now she is like "Maybe your mother is lonely. Maybe she needs you" And yet this lady KNOWS how my mother takes my money and such. And even IF it were true that my mom needed me?What can I do? I am in a wheelchair and have my own health issues. I can't take care of my mother who has Lupus! My mom says "WE can go on trips if you move here. Don't you miss not going anywhere?"an while I do my mother is in failing heallth. She is a nanny for 2 small kids and the little girl asked her one day why she walks like a penguin! My mom has arthritis, lupus and can barely walk. Yea I don't see us going anywhere. I said to my friend "If I did move in with her she would have control over my money again". I think I am done talking to this friend about my mother. She just doesn't get it because her parents were apparently perfect. People who have good decent parents don't get it! My mother didn't just start acting like this in the last 14 years. She has always been this way!

Yogagirl - sounds like it's time for your mom to get some help in the house before Dad is gone. Having been through this, I can tell you that the priority to worry about is their safety. Mom's happiness level is no measure of anything. Especially not successful caregiving. You can be doing the best job physically possible by a human being and she won't be happy.

I would start taking measures to alleviate dad's burden and have a plan in place for the day when they both need full time 24/7 care. All too often on this site, something happens and the family is now in a crisis with no plans.

It all hinges on how much you feel that you can do (not OUGHT to do) and still meet your obligations to yourself and your own family, job, residence, etc.

Putting my mom into a place where the doctor came there, the pharmacy came there, and she no longer had to depend on me to get out made a HUGE difference in life. I got lucky and found a nice continuum care campus that has it all - independent apartments all the way to hospice. Have those people to support her and me has been miraculous. But there is no one right way to do it.

You can come vent here any time you want.

sandwich, I love what you wrote. I read it the other day, then re-read it this evening. I couldn't write a more perfect description of my own mother. She doesn't look like a narcissist. She doesn't care much about her appearance. But she talks about herself, her childhood family, and my father like all was so perfect. There are bluebirds and butterflies fluttering all about her. Her family was perfect. Her marriage was perfect. She was and is perfect.

What is truly amazing is that apples can fall so far from the tree. My two living brothers and myself are so unlike my parents that it is hard to imagine that we are related.

I so totally feel for you. My mother is 85 lbs of mean, blameful, and selfish. I feel guilty if I don't see her daily to make sure she's eating etc. My therapist suggested limiting contact. She is living in her own home with dad who is 90, super sweet and frail and their caregiver. She has bullied dad and us two daughters, has an entitled
cold personality, and now I'm responsible for managing all her Dr appointments, and household. It's healthy to vent and keep a good sense of humor.

ELMO - A lot of narcissists live in a fantasy world and are very removed from reality. When things don't work out like the fantasy, they blow a gasket. Over & over. They never learn. Beware your mom's conviction around a fantasy and recognize it for what it is. Don't take the bait and try to make the fantasy come true. When you have to talk to her, you need to remind your mother of all the reasons you are so incompatible you could not possibly live together. Anything it takes to pop that fantasy balloon in her head. This is not a one-time conversation.

My mother had many fantasies over time that led to total disappointment for her. One was about how wonderful her marriage to my dad was. All she did was pick fights, argue, bicker, & complain about him until the night that man died of a heart attack. But ever since then, you would think she had been the prime example of a loving and affectionate wife to hear her tell it. She had a fantasy about needing a big house to do lots of entertaining after I went away to college and she was alone. She had a 4 bedroom house built and never invited anybody to come over for a social visit once because she hated visitors. She hated cleaning to get ready and any clean up after. She resented offering a glass of water. But she complained about how unfriendly everybody was in the area! Her fantasy around her old age care was that I would abandon my husband, children, bills, obligations, and career to move in with her. I would sit at her knee awaiting the next instruction, like a Golden Retriever, and devote the rest of my years to her every whim and demand. I’m no dog. Not even on a good day.

If this weren't your mother, you would have no question as to what to do, and that is RUN for the hills.
Just because your mother, sister, friend, lady at the checkout has said "It's going to happen" does not make it so. It will only happen if you let it. And if you let it happen, well....the outlook is not good.

When you are dealing with a borderline/narcissist personality, every word out of their mouth is manipulation. Even nice things are to coerce you. People are simply a means to an end – even sons & daughters. The bonds they do form are transactional. As long as you're of some use, they will keep you around, which isn't exactly a prize. The test is if the person has said something nice to you knowing there is absolutely nothing to be gained from it. A transactional person will say the nice thing and in short order expect you to "pay" for it in a way that benefits them.

so true:)

I think we all need to get a copy of our birth certificates and stamp "Paid in Full."

...sorry hit posted by accident.
So anyway, she just want you to be ethernally grateful to her for "everything she is done" for you... And when she is nice basically to get under your skin with all that niceness. Don't beleive it for a moment. The mother who loves her child will not distroy her life, will not torment her soul, will not play the game of beingnice once in a bluemoon, justto get what she wants...

don't agree. This is not what she REALLY thinks. As my mother says, this is the name of the game and , she never lost a game...
This game called manipulation. Yhe thought process goes like this... My daughter's sole existence is to pay back for my sleepless kniggts ehen she was a baby, for

"Your little hands were made to take
the better things, and leave the worse ones…"

Elmo, even if she only thinks you're a special daughter at highly selective moments, enjoy the moments. That's what she really thinks. Hold onto those for when she's being dreadful.

Then today she says "You are such a special daughter to me"! I about choked on my pizza. I'm special to her until I won't do what she wants. Then suddenly I am mentally handicapped and incapable to taking care of myself! She did the same with my brother. Bitched to me yesterday how he didn't send her flowers for mother's day. But he wished her happy mother's day on facebook and suddenly he is her 'Favorite son"! GThough he is her only son. Even my niece asked if she was bi-polar and she is 16!

Elmo, I particularly like the way your mother coats this in concern for your future: "I just don't want you to end up…" indeed!

Sweet of her to think of you. The lady is pretty good at this game, isn't she?

Thank her for her concern. Explain fulsomely that you will be just fine. You could, if you feel up to playing at this level, reassure her that you have made well-considered plans for your later career and retirement; but that of course it is a weight off your mind to know that she is settled in a salubrious climate etc.

Right back at ya, Elmo's mother...

She is not giving you a choice. Translation: She is giving you a guilt trip. The choice is always yours.

She says to me "Your aunt has had the SAME friends since high school" as if that is a terrible thing! She tells me that I am an adult and its my choice what to do but she is not really giving me a choice as she said about moving in together that "This is GOING to happen" I don't know if she is bipolar or what but it gives me a headache!

No. please... Don' make the
same mistake I did... It will never work out and hell is not even close to discribe what you are going to go through... will not repeat what I already wrote before, but I can see you, miserable, and look for any excuse NOT to go home and see her, hear her voice and she will make your life miserable...

*learned not earned

elmo - let her go ballistic. She will get over it. Tell her you are not living with her anywhere, and it is not open for discussion and then talk about something else. If she starts getting abusive over the phone - yelling etc - tell her you won't speak with her unless she is civil, and hang up and don't answer the rest of the day or however long you think it will take her to settle down, She is using her anger to manipulate you. She is changing her mind - so let her. You are not moving there - period, end of discussion. It doesn't have to impact you. Once she starts to pressure you on the phone, tell her you have to go and hang up. She is abusive and you don't have to put up with it. My mother is too and uses anger to try to get her way. I have earned to not even pick up the phone sometimes, or to hang up when she gets abusive and to distance myself more and more from her for my own survival. You need to apply boundaries and to detach from your mother. It s the only way to deal with someone like her.

And then after telling me last week me moving to Arizona is NOT a good idea after all? Now she is pressuring me to move there again.

HELP! My mom calls me today to thank me for the flowers I sent for Mother's Day. I was fine. Then she tells me she got in trouble at her job(though with my mom its hard to tell what really happened). Yet she didn't get fired and they gave her a mother's day plant the next day thanking her for what she does for them! Anyways, she is now pressuring me to make a decision about living with her and where. She tells me "You are an adult and it's your decision" but then goes on to say "I just don't want you to end up like your Aunt Peggy(her sister) who never does anything or goes anywhere! OMG. I am literally shaking since getting off the phone with her. I love my mother but I don't want to live with her and I know when I tell her that she is going to go ballistic!

I relate to this very much it has been this way most off my life my mom is 76 she is a very negative and unhappy person and lives in the pass and repeat her story's from the pass over and over again it has been that way all my life I don't think I can really remember her being truly happy !she has always wanted to kill herself or wishes she would die,she always finding something wrong with herself it's one thing or another ,she dose suffer from mentally illness ,she has 6 kids including me everyone lives in another state she has always mainly dependent on me , I have depression myself I have Spent many years and a lot of money going to canceling to be a more healthy person ! I have had to stop contact with some of my siblings because it's just to unhealthy for me! My mom lives around the block from me I have somewhat a relationship with her it's very hard I think it makes me depressed ,I can only be around her maybe one day a week and sometime none at all ! Sometime I think the only peace she is going to have is when she passes away, it make me very very sad what a waste of life she very smart and intelligent she could of done so much with her life!!! I'm just trying not to lose myself with all the craziness in my family!!!

Elmapalooza- She does not sound like much of a friend, she certainly is not listening to you. I am amazed when people are so free with telling others what they "should" do.

What really gets me is then whenever I try and tell people about my mom they think I am either exaggerating or that she is just "lonely"! My mother is far from lonely. A friend of mine when I first told her about my mom was pretty suprised and she was very supportive and shocked at how my mom treated me. Even heard my mom call me mentally disabled. But now she thinks she is just "lonely" and that I should just move in with her! It's hard to make people understand what she is like because when people DO meet her she is on her best behavior!

ELMOPALOOZA - DO NOT - I repeat - DO NOT EVER move in with a controlling person. Be it parent, friend, or significant other. Life will be a level of Hades that Dante forgot to write about. Add dementia to personality disorders and you may get yourself into a pickle that is very hard to get out of.

You are an adult who does not owe anyone any kind of explanation about your boundaries and choices. Write that out 100 times a day until it sticks. You get to own your choices and decisions. You don't owe mom.

There are a lot of us on this site who have lived with a narcissistic parent to do old age caregiving. Safe to say it will darn near kill you. A lot of people come to this site in a real crisis because they let mom/dad move in and reality is not matching with the Disney movie that was in everyone's head. It never does.

Dementia gets worse in spurts nobody can predict. Whatever the state of things "today", it may not be like this in 2 weeks, 6 weeks, or who knows. My mother compared to a year ago is much, much, much worse and needs an extremely high level of care. It takes 2-3 people to transfer her.

When you do finally talk to your mom, be prepared for fireworks. If she gets ugly, tell her that you will have to talk about it later when she isn't upset and hang up. We can talk when you aren't upset (which is code for being mean and terrible).

Tell your mom what I told mine. Use what you can:
- My home is not safe for you. You will fall and I can't pick you up.
- My bathrooms can't be modified for rails and other safety equipment.
- I won't give up my cats and they are a fall hazard as much as the stairs
- I will not quit my job to stay home with you all day.
- My home is not a dementia ward. I didn't say it so plainly, but that's what I meant. I will not live in a dementia ward and neither will my family.
- I don't have staff to cover 24/7/365 like they do in assisted living
- I don't have a commercial washer
- I don't have a commercial kitchen
- I don't have cleaners and janitors
- I don't have an activities director
- I can't lift you or help you transfer
- I will absolutely not do her butt wiping.
- I can't afford to replace carpet and furniture when bodily accidents happen. And they will a lot more than you think with dementia.
- I don't have enough time off work to run you to various doctor appointments. A one hour appointment was never less than a 5 hour ordeal with her. The doctors go to her in the nursing home.
- I can't keep you from wandering out of my home and getting lost.

Go explore assisted living or if she needs more care, a memory care community where they can handle her changing needs, any kind of crisis that will come up, and you get to keep your home as a safe haven from her stress.

Well without my help, my mom finally realized that me moving to Arizona is a bad idea! So at least I can skip that conversation with her. But she still wants us to live together! The thought of that makes me cringe. I love my mom but she can be mean and nasty and the thought of living with her just fills me with dread because I know she will harp on me for things. She treats me like I am 4 not 41. Good thing is that she can't really do anything about moving here until next Spring. So in that time things could change and she might decide it's not a good idea. But if not then I am going to have to tell her how I feel and with my mom and the way she can act I am not looking forward to that.

You are so smart!

This site is great and has given me comfort in knowing I'm not the only one going through a difficult situation with my parents. I grew up with a narcisistic self centered dad and my mom was co-dependent. I often compare their relationship to the Stockholm Syndrome. I'm now 62 y.o. but all my life I hid behind my dad's verbal and emotional abuse. I was actually very afraid of him. As he got older he got nastier; which didn't surprise me. When I wanted to help, he pushed me totally out of his life. I ended up not seeing him the last year of his life. In fact, when he died I was notified by their attorney three months later that he had passed. A very dysfunctional family. Now my mom is 83 with dementia and acts just like my father. When I tried to help her, she locked me out of the house & pushed me out of her life as well. It's been eight months since I've visited or spoken with her. I had to separate myself from the toxic situation, it was destroying me. Thank you for this website. I no longer feel alone.

You are not alone. My mother has been very self-focused and hyperbolic her entire life. I visualize her as a gaping sucking pit into which you can throw your entire self to be completely consumed, after which she would complain that you were completely inadequate. Our family does one of two things - walk away entirely and have nothing to do with her, or give in to her constant demands and insults because it is easier than fighting. Doctors have refused to treat her anymore. I believe she suffers from something called Borderline Personality Disorder. If you do a web search of the term, you will find lots of information on children of Borderline parents.

I've come to realize she can't give to me (love, gratitude, acceptance) what she can't give to herself. Her issues are not my fault. I can't fix her. It is not reasonable for her to take over my life. I try to focus on hating the illness, and not the person. It's hard.

rovan, I hear your point, but I would add that the other side of the coin for many mentally ill is often how expensive their meds are, how limited many of those with more severe mental illness are when it comes to gaining income by keeping a steady job.

Another part of the problem is that the limited safety net that use to be there has been dismantled by state governments to save money. This has increased the number of homeless people with a mental illness and has changed many of our prisons into modern mental health hospitals.

VeryTired, mentally ill people who refuse to take medications/get treatment are perhaps the biggest problem in our society - ask the police who have to deal with them, their children who are abused by them, and on and on. This idea of hands off started because of serious abuses in mental hospitals, etc. Commitments by relatives wanting to get their hands on money, etc. But the pendulum has swung way too far! We have carried this to extremes here in the United States. Ask any law enforcement officer - dealing with mentally ill people is a nightmare they did not sign up for. For now, you have done as much as you reasonably can, far more really than any obligation you might have. You cannot fix her broken brain yourself so now the wise thing to do is to take care of yourself. You need to be strong and healthy for you, and that is the best course to follow now. Beating your head against a wall will help neither your head nor the wall.

Don't do it! I did the same thing. 14 months later I have lost $50,000 and endured unimaginable stress. I left the situation basically with the shirt on my back and barely enough money to start over. I look back on the situation now and wonder why.....