I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
Hopefully, SIL has more competent physicians.
It was an electric line, owned by whoever it is in their municipality that runs electric lines to homes. I'm not sure what that entity is in their neck of the woods.
Not that it matters. One is trimming trees at their own peril.
I have heard since all this got on the radar .. that one can .. (I didn't know this) call the local electric authority and request they come kill the power, so that you can go trim trees in the vicinity. I never knew one could request such a thing, and I'm not sure how much anyone else knows that.
Obviously my brother didn't know it, .. or he'd of done so.
Yes, that's very much a choice she can make for herself .. and we can all just get over it.
I guess, where it hits me broadside is all the lamenting that goes on. Her swollen feet/ankles .. and ... the stress this is all causing her. I just don't have the patience for it all, anymore.
I guess, there's a sense in me, there's nothing I can say or do .. in any of this, that makes one hill of beans of any difference. So why bother.
Yes you hate it for her, this is all so stressful to her. Yes, you hate it for her, that you just want her to be happy, .. yes you hope to get the Lasix on board and functional routinely ..
All good things .. go for it. There's a part of me that knows, . I am just someone to vent to, in SIL. She has no one, not really, that knows this thing in and out backwards and forwards, .. like I do .. like she does. Her husband .. he of the bipolar disorder and a shell of an existence, not real talkative .. ever. Her brother .. we know his response level, pretty negligible. So .. there is a sense in me, of the knowing .. she just needs someone to talk to. I do realize that. But ... it's the same ole same ole, and doesn't seem to be any real recognition for "what IS", vs what "we WISH WAS". Seems to be too much of that, .. and that I don't have the tolerance for any longer.
But yes, .. if she had the care .. someone to work her life with a stopwatch and all her needs .. PT .. and hygeine .. and meds .. hydration/nutrition .. so forth and so on, transport .. all of it .. the very things SHE DOES NOT WANT ........... her existence could be a little more pleasurable than what she presently lives.
I did feel a tinge of sadness as I walked by and saw, soaking in a washtub on the washer .. some soiled stained underpants .. and MIL had asked me, on her grocery list, to get some bleach .. that she's been working with one particular pair .. that the stains won't lift ..........
That caused me to feel so very bad for her.
I know her hand dexterity .. it's nil. I know her hand strength .. same. I know her ability to stand leaned against the washer, as she begins to feel herself slipping towards the floor .. as she works with trying to lift stains from a clothing item laying soaking.
It made me sad for her.
For the whole thing.
There was a time, I'd of taken that ball and run with it, in the sense, "let's do this MIL .. let's go ahead and toss this out, while we're out today, we're gonna run by _______________ store, and pick up some new underpants .. and hey ... let's make sure you have plenty of Depends .. ya know .. you'll want to make sure you use those instead .. when you get stricken with Diahrea, so that you can save these underpants and not have to throw them in the trash".
There was a time I was that mired in it, and would've seen to the above.
I don't anymore. And it just makes me sad . the whole thing. Not from the respect that I wanna jump back in to the above degree .. on that or any other issues .. I don't. But just sad .. I know what the struggles are for her, and they are very very real ... it's not that she's lazy and no interest in taking care of herself .. she just is not able to do it anymore. But she's the last person to know that. So very apparent.
So don't be offended and don't feel SIL is getting at you - she isn't. It's worth doing when it's practical, and in a couple of weeks so it will be practical. Yay!
At this time, have a pretty heavy heart for my brother's situation .. and that stress.
So, at least for me, the whole MIL saga .. and all the under pinnings .. not a lot of sympathy and I think .. maybe for me, it's better I did get to where I don't care and don't address it that the Lasix isn't on board .. fighting it never made any difference anyway, so I don't ask anymore. Purposely.
Yes, her feet/ankles were deplorable .. she could barely get any shoes on .. didn't she have to wear house slippers recently when YD took her for her dental appt., because shoes won't fit .. her swollen feet/ankles. They were really pretty swollen .. so much so there is a fold of skin/retention .. at the feet where the skin has such a backup of fluid that the skin kinda folds over there. No, I didn't bring it up to the doc, and no they didn't ask or examine.
SIL then asking me, .. if the docs had noted it, looked, and I answered no. Her then saying she hopes to get that on board daily .. when she gets her there.
I only answered that with: "yep, would be a good thing".
I'm trying not to really belabor it all, is my mindset .. because to do so, with SIL is usually an exercise in some frustration.
SIL then asks: "How did she seem to you, is she doing any better with the thought of coming here .. is she feeling any better about that".
Me: "Maybe some, I don't know, we didn't talk about it".
SIL: "I know it's so stressful for her, and I hate that. Of course, I worry that the ongoing work here, with my basement is gonna be cause for too much disruption for her, .. but I don't know what else to do. I hate it that she's so stressed about it"
Me: "She seems to stress about most anything these days that doesn't include sitting at her kitchen table, pondering her b'yard with her PJ's on .. she was stressed about going to the doc today .. and said more than once, she IS NOT going to consent to any procedures, that they better not suggest that, she wants no part of it, stressed about that, seems to stress about most things".
SIL: "I hate adding more stress to her, .. with this temporary move up this way .. Just want her to be happy".
At that I kinda blew, in my own way of doing so, and unloaded on her, about what stress really is. THIS is not stress.
Cited to her what it is my brother and his wife and that kid are facing, that is stress .. through and through .. sleepless nights, night after night .. an albatross that will hang on them for the rest of their lives .. that whole situation .. that is stress, going to your daughter's home is NOT stress .. not in any way/shape/form, and I have little patience for any of it.
Of course then our convo turned to talking the ins and outs of the situation with my brother, which suited me better. I just don't have it in me, to find the sympathy they seem to feel .. over this impending xfer to IL .. I just don't have it. And lamenting all of it, .. it only serves to anger/frustrate me.
Does MIL know of the situation with my brother and the comparison as to stress levels? She knows a thumb nail sketch of the goings on. Mostly she is saved from the gory details of it all, because she of the wring your hands, gnash your teeth sort, and nothing better to do, will worry herself silly over something (my brother's situation) she has absolutely zero to do with .. and so she is spared the blow by blow of it all. So no, she doesn't know the nitty gritty of it all.
I think if I hear it one more time, ... I will blow. I'm sick of it. That the work she has ongoing, will be too disruptive .. that it's so stressful for her.
GET OVER IT PEOPLE, it's what needs to happen. Not my fault or anyone else's that she has aged to the point she needs more help. DEAL with the reality of what "IS" rather than the "hate it all", rather than the "I wish it wasn't that way", ... deal with the reality of "WHAT IS". Get over it!
Yesterday being with her. When I arrived there, .. I'd gone inside to let her know I was there, pick up her grocery list .. and she was still in her PJ's. As always. I did remind/prompt, .. "Now I'm going to the store, while I'm gone, you need to work on getting ready, so we're not late". She said she'd do so.
When I got back from that, she as indeed dressed and ready to go, sitting at the kitchen table as I traveled about her kitchen putting away the things she'd had me get for her (loosening caps on things .. she struggles with the hand strength to open, per se, a bottle of gatorade, .. has to be opened and then re-sealed, otherwise, she doesn't have the hand-strength to get it open).
She was telling me that DH had called her (just to check in) while I was gone. And that she told him, .. she's just so tired. She goes on to tell me, "you know, now that I did go get dressed, .. I just feel so very tired, and wish I could go to bed, .. I just don't have any stamina at all anymore, for anything, it's all I can do just to get clothes on, and that does me in".
I responded to that, "well maybe some of that PT that SIL wants you to get while you're up that way, maybe that will help to build a little bit of stamina".
That then opened the conundrum of her lamenting her plight that she now has to go to IL and would rather just die than have to do this. I didn't engage, on purpose, changed the subject.
You want to say to her, .. (but it would do no good) .. "let's you and me, stop off today and go talk to some nursing home folks .. I'm sure the staff there can show us more than a few that never once have a single visitor .. no one that gives a crap whether they live or die, or get any access to healthcare that will somehow work to better their circumstance, .. let's go talk to one of them .. or a few of them, and then tell me you'd rather die .. than be carted off to your daughter's .. a daughter that loves you and wants to help you, and has a clean/climate controlled home .. and will be a social outlet for you, as well as looking after some health concerns ... I really don't want to hear it MIL .. save it for the folks who don't have a soul in this world that cares about them.
I do wonder at times, does she have enough processing left in her brain, if the above were said, would it even give her pause for a moment to reflect on the fact that "it aint all that bad". Would it? I don't know.
I hadn't slept much the night before, .. had been on the phone with my brother and his wife .. just a sounding board here .. as they weather some tense times with the situation on their end, and the kid who was injured. Things have gotten more complicated on their end .. and messy. Long and short, one of the insurances involved has denied any culpability in it all, and lawsuits have now commenced. The boy's health .. not progressing as they would like, with some of his injuries. It's complicated and messy and very very stressful and heart wrenching, the whole thing. It had caused me to toss and turn all night. My heart breaks for all involved.
So then, .. maybe understandable, maybe not .. I don't know. Last night when I get a text from SIL.
SIL: "Did you happen to notice mother's feet/ankles, did the docs look at them, were they okay".
Me: "They were horrible, and no the doc didn't look at them and I didn't suggest they do so. I don't do that any longer, doesn't change anything, .. you ask her if she took her Lasix and the answer is always no".
SIL: "Maybe once I get her up here, I can work on getting her to take that more routinely, God knows she needs to do it".
(((Bear in mind, my mindset .. while I do love and care for MIL .. otherwise I wouldn't even see to her the one day a week I do so. I also ..
So LOTS of good progress made yesterday at the doctor's! It looks like MIL really WILL be getting on that plane!
CM, SIL is coming a week before the flight to pack for MIL.
I wonder how much these doctors really note down the living arrangements of elderly patients. Although my mother's PCP asked me 1.5 years ago if I thought my mother should be living alone, apparently it hasn't come up since then. (Or has it? I'm not allowed into the examining room anymore.) I imagine my mother showtimes for the doctor. The doctor must know she doesn't drive anymore, and so since THAT isn't an issue, the rest doesn't matter. I wonder what the dr. would say if she knew my mother was only showering 1x/week because she's so unsteady getting into and out of the tub (which my mother refuses to have modified)? Honestly, I think it's on my mother's records that a daughter lives in town, and so the PCP (if she's even considered it) probably assumes I'm helping a lot more than I am. Oh, well! I get the real feeling that they don't delve too deeply.
As long as MIL won't take her diuretic the rest of it is more or less pointless; she won't have the energy for her PT and balance exercises and so can't benefit from them. That is the single thing she could do that would make her feel better once she's past the initial effort and discomfort. When she is safely on the plane, tell SIL that - if you only accomplish one thing, make it giving her her Lasix as prescribed and extra assistance getting to the bathroom so that it isn't so miserable for her. Once there is a real routine established, and she's feeling better for it, it should become less of a battle.
The Ciproflaxin is a prophylactic antibiotic. Well. If she's not getting uti's it's arguably working.
I personally am thinking of starting a book on whether or not MIL will return from IL. Assuming she gets there.
Speaking of which. What about packing? Who's been volunteered for that?
Maybe DH could hire daughter of the twins to do the work you now do for the business.
You need to become majorly unavailable for MIL schlepping.
It is beyond unfortunate that DH & Company is SO content to hang (some version of) the DDD label on Dorker — and promptly stick their heads back up their behinds.
Dorker, when MIL is in Illinois, turn your back on all the nonsense. All. The. Nonsense.
For the past 5-10 years, SIL couldn’t get over herself long enough to see a movie with you or take a walk around the neighborhood. SIL is showing her true colors. Has been for a long time. To h*ll with decades of personal connection.....vacations....holidays.....your kids & her kids having fun together.
Why? Sometimes there is no why. This family is rife with personality disorders. And they (figuratively) got their money’s worth out of you, Dorker. And then some.
If you don’t separate yourself from their sorry delusions — and I mean full stop — you’ll be the next one having a stroke or a heart attack or popping a vein.
Dorker, you married DH. The rest is collateral damage. Old habits die hard, but you would do well to block SIL’s texts and purge that idiocy from your life.
Can you think of one person in DH’s family who would schlep your mother to the dermatologist or deliver pet food to your father? (Let alone a 1-2-3-day a week commitment? For years??) Didn’t think so.
Save yourself, Dorker. ((((hugs)))) 🧡
Also, when she goes to her PCP, SIL or someone should ask about the Cipro and tell the doc about the recent bad bout of diarrhea that she had. It's a pretty strong antibiotic and long term use can cause some serious side effects in some people, including neuropathy and severe diarrhea.
She asks MIL "have you fallen?, I mean .. since xmas .. have you fallen anymore".
SIL chimes in, "no not since xmas".
I chime in, .. "uhm .. yea .. you fell in the den a month or so ago .. and it took you two hours to get up, remember that?".
MIL: "Yes I've fallen a couple of times, .. I'm always a hair's breath from falling yes".
Doc: "Well you know . it's very important that you do what you can to continue to maintain some strength and work on that balance, if you don't .. you will fall and likely end up in a nursing home, it's that important .. at your age, .. falls can be really bad .. really really bad .. and so you need to do that, .. and .. you also need to be on that Gabapentin as to the Neuropathy in your feet/legs .. if your brain doesn't know the placement of those legs/feet that's going to worsen your problem .. so yes .. you really do need to go and stay with your daughter, or maybe consider somewhere safer to live".
This met with a resounding sigh and pushback on MIL's part, and nothing further added on that topic from doc.
But hopefully it was noted in the chart, fwiw .. as to that piece of dialogue.
Is being sent to PCP for renewal of the Gabapentin .. they don't rx that .. heart doc. Being sent to PCP for renewal of Ciproflaxin (sp?) .. "why do you need that?". "Oh because I'm so prone for that Diverticulitis and for UTI". Oh okay well you need to talk to your PCP about renewing that.
Something said about trying to get with PCP .. the cardio doc shooting a note to do so .. to get the PCP to try to work her in before departure and SIL chiming in at that point as to when she'd be here, to facilitate said visit to PCP .. so .. was glad that didn't land in my lap to now step to that beat .. go get her to a PCP .. for me to then defer to her son .. (who I know won't be doing it).
Then it was finished there, and she wanted to go to the favorite burger place and so that's what we did.
I'd already gotten there earlier and cleaned out her garbage can outside that seems to be drawing flies by the hundreds .. and then ran to the grocery for her .. and then it was off to the doc ..
So that encompasses the visit there.
I did find opportunity to interject a question as to the doc's "Take" on living alone and her infirmities, more on that in a bit.
The purpose of today's visit .. was to go over and make sure her meds, have enough rx refills that she can successfully see to a few months worth of being away.
Reviewing those. She has her Eliquis .. that is a patient assistance program and she is working from some bottle that is expired? That was questioned .. why? No answer. No resolution there. I can only assume she maybe used some old bottle sitting around for some odd reason and put new ones in it ...??... I dunno.
SIL on the phone during whole thing.
Nothing from her. There was discussion on a refill for her Acid Reflux med .. some Proton Inhibitor .. something. That has enough refills she should be good, but they said they'd write another rx in case.
Reviewed her Lasix rx .. and at that I chimed in, .. "she really struggles with taking that as she needs to, as you can see" (pointing at her swollen ankles/feet). Again, nothing from SIL on that. Not chiming in. They cautioned that her heart is having to work harder to rid her body of the fluid build up and how important . blah blah blah. Heard it all before. Doesn't change it.
I chimed in at that point, "do you have any opinion on whether or not it's safe she remain living alone .. she has some problems really maintaining .. ".
Doc: "You mentioned you're going to your daughter's, is that permanent?"
MIL: "No, .. not supposed to be, I hope not".
Doc: "Well you mentioned that you're also looking for a prescription for some PT while you're there, what's that about, what's going on there?".
MIL: "Well my balance is just so bad .. I mean, I am all the time trying to fall, all the time ... if I go to turn around, .. or turn to the side, I have to really slowly/gingerly do it .. or I'll be in the floor .. I can't stand for any period of time, without holding onto something .. my balance is so bad".
Doc now looking thru the chart, asks, if she's seen an ENT ..
She answers that it's been a while, .. but yes has .. and goes on to answer that this is all a result of the stroke she had back in 2004 .. but it seems to be getting worse, .. the balance issues .. lack of any strength .. the neuropathy (we'd already covered the ground that her Gabapentin for neuropathy is a full, untouched bottle that expired a year ago, and she doesn't take it .. but needs to .. needs to be on that .. for the neuropathy .. that ground had been covered).
So the doc now chiming in .. now looking thru the chart, .. asks if she's had a CT of her brain .. as she's looking thru the chart. SIL chimes in .. "you had that when you were hospitalized in December .. with that fall .. they did a CT ... ".
Doc then finds that in the chart, .. then says, "yes I see here where there was damage in the brain from a stroke ...",
Then .. I chimed in, .. put my two cents in ... "when she was hospitalized summer of 2017 .. there, the neuro doc found evidence of further micro bleed in her brain .. and said that she has had other "damage" other than the original .. so that may explain ..",
At that I was cut off by SIL chiming in, "that hospitalization was for a UTI .. and so they cleared that up and she was fine".
At that, the doc then, .. looking, "yes I see her, some notes on some microbleeds found .. and yes, that might explain why you feel you're worsening as to your strength and balance, and the only thing we can really do to addressing that is going to be some PT ... that will help ... some .. but you have to do it ...
Then turns to me, .. "it's going to be really important .. to answer your question .. if she's going to her daughter's .. that's good, because yes .. depending on how much she struggles .. that may be something that needs to be permanent ..
I was thinking about this earlier while escorting my mother s l o w l y through the grocery store.
Dorker, perhaps you should just visit MIL once a week. *Maybe* bring lunch or something you have baked. But that's it! When you do basically anything for her on that day, you have tiptoed into the mess of MIL's life. Go just for a social visit. No grocery shopping, no doctor visits, no deck sweeping or flower deadheading, and no Poochy duties. MIL badly needs socialization. Fulfill that need by being a regular visitor on that one morning a week.
Leave the rest of it to her children.
7 days until SIL arrives and 14 days until they both go to the airport and are GONE!
Barb is pretty darn wise....it probably is time, with MIL being out of your sightline for a couple months--to work through the past anger at her and put it to bed.
WE all get it. Wish WE could be there to physically stand and support you. But, tho none of us are THERE we DO support your decision to pull back, and we all know all the stories and reasons. MIL is bat-chit crazy. Your tales of life with her have alternately horrifying and hilarious.
But, hon, like CM says, we don't need to be convinced of it. We're with ya.
I think you're using this site as a great sounding board (we all do!) but eventually we have to put our issues in a box and store them.
You're never going to "win" with SIL, Just quit trying. Maybe, just maybe you need to pull out 100% and just be a DIL, who visits occasionally--but doesn't get involved in daily care--not even for 6 hours on Thursdays. It seems to still cause you such anger and pain. No matter how often you bring up the stupid and vain things MIL has elected to do--it doesn't change the fact she did them and they were stupid and a waste of time and money she doesn't have.
I can say this--about not being in your MIL's life, because I broke up with MINE 20 years ago. Worked and still working in therapy to get over the anger I felt and still feel towards her for sooooo many things.
Your crazy MIL needs so much help and support and you are NOT obligated to do anything else for her. She seems completely oblivious to all that everyone does for her. That would rankle.
CAN you put her on that plane next week and walk away, dust off the seat of your britches and let her go? Just, let her go. And all the hurts, and slights and nastiness and fussing. Spend time with her when she comes home ONLY if you want to. Block SIL's # and simply don't talk to her unless you want to.
I'm feeling your anger and anxiety just ramping up each day as "the day" approaches. She's not worth it.
This may sound mean, and I DO NOT intend for it to---but you need to have a life that doesn't have this added, completely ridiculous stress in it.
She can figure out to call an Uber or she can sit home on her butt. She can be a grown up and work on moving to a better living situation, or she can sit all alone with her junk and her decrepit dog and watch the world go by her window.
But it's your choice. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome has proven to fail, time after time. It's not going to get better.
You have MY support, whatever you do. I am amazed at the love you still express for this kookoo bird.
At some point, though, for your own mental health, you have to let this anger go.
Hope you have good day----and it could be your last with MIL.....how does that sound?
{{Hugs, cause you need them!}}
Liz
She's not ignoring it, she's failed to find a way to do it. That's not at all the same thing. Don't fall into the trap of imagining that this would be easily solvable if SIL would just put her mind to it and order her mother to comply.
Do indeed absolutely suggest a call to SIL at the doctor's to allow her to participate in the consult. Put her in charge, tell her she's in charge, and above all DON'T stand in for her! Anyone - doctor, nurse, receptionist, MIL, anybody - tries to hand information to you, immediately redirect it. The aim here is a single point of contact which is not you.
SIL fully aware an ongoing issue, lack of med compliance, edema results .. recommendation ...support hose. Countless times this has been the case. Summarily ignored.
SIL fully aware recommendation made as to a more secure living arrangement ... recommendation made as to further cognitive testing ... recommendation as to a PT program for assessment of driving.
Ignored.
Just to name a couple of many different instances.
I am going to take the sage advice here and phone SIL while at doc .. let her voice her wants ... and stand guard as to arm twists for further magical thinking and reject same
Will try to find opportunity to interject solicitation of doc's take on longer term recommendations and the struggles faced ... if I can throw it in somehow.
Will report back later.
Look. If you splice SIL with MIL's medical team, the communication is between her and them. Should SIL then turn to you to say "we've got appointments set up Monday, Tuesday afternoon, three on your Thursday and Friday morning, jump to it" you say...
"No."
SIL wants these things attended to, SIL must make the logistical arrangements, and those arrangements do not include you.
It isn't unreasonable for SIL to want her mother to be offered all possible health care support. Pain, investigate. Symptoms, treat. Sure. But at the moment she's trying to do that in the fog, precisely because she isn't the single point of communication and therefore can't collate all the information, and unsurprisingly she is making a pig's breakfast of it.
If you are not going to pass information on to someone who can reliably use it, do not accept it in the first place. So, do not make calls, do not allow any doctors to tell you anything that needs to be acted on, do not do diddly. ALL information needs to make its way to the person who will shortly be responsible for managing MIL's healthcare, and that is SIL. Give anyone who needs it her number and/or her email address.
I'm not clear on that one myself and will ask MIL .. does she take that, and if so, maybe on her behalf I'll call the neurology doc to make sure that's in order ...
And ... (important here) .. I'll inform MIL as to my findings there, NOT SIL. MIL can impart this to her daughter .. if that's the case, or she can forget or not .. whatever.
Yes, I am mad .. even still .. of course I am. Yes, she is to finally depart .. it looks like, within a week or two here .. (temporarily) .. and what happens beyond that, is anybody's guess (these people that don't sit down and talk about the big frickin elephant in the room). Yes, I'm angry about it.
But at the root of that is this ............ my good graces to have thought . there was a team approach in all this. There isn't.
There is the magic solution of a "Team MIL" that saw her left here to manage. No opinion or input sought from those who would need to step up here. There's the magic solution of "vein ablation" that it was thought Dorker will see thru .. when she departs .. for IL. There's the magic solution .. that Gluten testing will solve the gut issues .. (no SIL it won't, Diverticulitis is the issue, not Gluten) but arm twisting that ensues.
No, I'm no longer walking that plank.
If SIL wants to enact any number of magical solutions as to restoration of her mom's health have at it.
I happen to be here .. and for a long time was the boots on the ground to it all, .. and she'd show up and stand on her head for three weeks, doing everything but breathe for her mom . not even . in doing so .. getting a clear/accurate portrayal of her mom's capabilities or lackthereof, even when I'd urge she do otherwise.
I'll take her to the cardo today I'll address the issues I'm aware of, and nothing more. And MIL can report those to her daughter, or she can do the whole "confused, I dunno .. I don't know what we talked about, I didn't wanna talk about all that "S" .. you call them".
I don't care.
Not that I don't care about MIL and her well being, I do very much so. I don't care about answering to SIL .. she can do that with her mom, who is thought to be of sound mind. If she doesn't get her questions answered sufficiently to suit her, she knows the cardio doc's phone number, call them.
My objective isn't coming from a place of being overly punitive and/or maybe too myopic. It's coming from a place of... I have played along in this for a number of years and jumped to the beat of the drum .. for a long long long time and willingly so .. but when it became a matter that all these magic solutions aren't going to improve things ...
Gluten testing ..
Vein ablation
Lack of med compliance
Needs more support
And yet magical thinking is the order of the day at SIL's behest. I quit engaging her.
She can either see to her mom's care as she sees fit . and do it herself .. or she can direct her mom to do so .. thought to be of sound mind and judgement. But she can now .. and as of several mos. ago .. get out of my space with what she thinks as to magic solutions.
I'm not doing it.
So no, I won't be calling SIL to have her part of any dialogue there at the cardio doc. I haven't heard from her, thankfully as to my marching orders for the day .. as we set off for the cardio doc. Thankfully.
I did call MIL last night to confirm she is aware that she has a cardio appt and that I'll be there.
I got back some addled/frazzled, .. "well yes I think that's still on the agenda .. I haven't heard otherwise .. I guess I need to talk to "S" .. she had all this list of things she wanted me seeing to there, and I'm not even sure what all she wanted me to see to, I need to, I guess get with her".
Me: "Well to my knowledge she wants to make sure your rx's are in order, so they can be retrieved up in IL ............ and she wants a written order for some PT .. so that also can be seen to on her end".
MIL: "Well, I'm not sure about all that, but the meds ... don't I need to sit down and list all the meds .. I mean .. won't they need to know what all I take?".
Me: "The cardio doc has a list in your record of what they rx for you . you don't need to come up with a list .. they know what they write scripts for you to take .. it's part of your record. SIL just wants to make sure that's in order, so that refills can be seen to".
MIL: "Well is that all I take, whatever they give me, .. do I take anything that other docs rx?, I don't know ... will they write rx's for the other things I take .. is that what this is about".
Me: "I don't think so, no .. but I don't guess SIL is concerned so much with something else you might take .. I don't think you take anything else, that is rx'd by some other doc .. but we'll talk to them tomorrow".
MIL: "Well I guess I need to talk to "S" and see, is that all she wanted seen to, .. ya know, she told me what all it is we're to see to, but I Swear Dorker I don't remember .. I don't know what all she wants taken care of .. I guess I need to talk to her and write it all down".
Me: "yes that's a great plan .. when you talk to her later, write it all down and that way you'll have it".
MIL: "Well ya know, my hand writing .. I struggle so anymore to even hold an ink pen to write anything .. it's all .. all of it Dorker, it's all just too much anymore".
Me: "I know, it's hell gettin old aint it, .. oh well, in any event I'll see you tomorrow and we'll go from there".
I have, on purpose, not put in a phone call to SIL to ask her, .. "now list for me, let me write it down, what are your wants as to this visit and let me itemize them so we can see to them, better yet .. how bout you be available, and I'll phone you as we sit there and you can voice your concerns right there on the spot.
I purposely didn't do that.
I did talk to the MIL .............. thought to be of sound mind and judgement. On purpose.
So we will see.
I will ask her, only for my own curiosity .............. when I see MIL today .. I know at one time she was rx'd (likely by the neurologist) .. Gabapentin (Sp?), neuropathy in her feet/legs.
The last I knew of it, she didn't take it, because it caused dizziness, but I also remember something said about take it at bed time .. so I'm
Doc: "We can talk about trying to order a home health aide to come by a couple of times a week to assist if you'd like".
MIL: (remember I've been there, heard all this countless times) .. "No, I really just dont' want that, I don't want someone coming and going all the time, I really just don't want to do that".
SIL: "Well isn't there anything else we can do .. isn't there something else that might help with that"?
I presume (I wasn't there, so I don't know for sure) .. the doc likely at that point, mentioned vein ablation .. and the merits and so forth of that .. (though what that has to do with alleviating edema .. I dunno ... ).
There ya go, magic potion/pill/procedure. MIL now signed on .. but no way to get there, unless SIL wants to (see above) you want your mom cared for thus and so, then figure a way to get your azz front and center and do it. She saw to some of these vein ablations . but was to leave for IL again .. and wanted me on that front line. I declined.
My thinking .. "that's a bunch of snake oil salesman stuff .. no thanx .. ".
Confirmed even more so, when .. she was then hospitalized shortly afterwards for the UTI .. @discharge a home health nurse to now call upon MIL a couple of times a week, at home. The nurse there, taking the health history and any procedures/meds ongoing. Vein ablation is mentioned by SIL .. and the nurse .. hesitated a moment (of course my radar went up, because it was my belief that was a pipe dream as to any edema issue) .. the nurse hesitated a moment and acted as if she might have something to say but didn't. So I let her finish . when she finished, I asked her opinion .. on the vein ablation .. and she said something like this:
Well, .. that really isn't gonna be all that beneficial .. this is a CHF issue .. not a cosmetic issue .. that really is .. it lines the doc's pockets more than anything else, it's not gonna benefit her .. not for CHF and edema .. ".
THANK YOU! My opposition to begin with.
SIL and MIL both heard this exchange between me and the nurse, they were sitting right there. SIL then pipes in, "REALLY? .. I wonder why the cardiologist recommended it .. if it's not going to be helpful". The nurse interjected at that point .. "Sometimes they will, if nothing else, offer whatever they can .. if nothing else is working, if it's not harmful .. and this won't harm her, but in the end, it's really not gonna be all that beneficial not when CHF and med compliance is more the issue".
BINGO!
Oh but let's get that magic thinking fired up!
History is the best predictor of the future, and I've got a lot of history that tells me how this whole thing rolls, .. especially when I act in accordance with what would be a "team" approach. There is no "team". It's Dorker, step to the beat of the magic thinking drum .. that's the "team" in it.
Dorker stepped off that arm twisting sometime back.
Yes, .. when SIL was so insistent (ruminating yes, but the point here is that I have been there/seen it, bought the tee shirt .. on how it all goes) .. SIL insistent that I bring doggie diapers to the scene when the dog was ill .. and I said, argued my point, to no avail .. she can't do doggie diapers SIL .. her hands are so arthritic she wont' be able to do it. Arm twisting ensues, off Dorker goes .. to the pet store, diapers for doggies. In fact, get there and because of his girth .. the doggie diapers bought .. don't fit, back to the store, to exchange for larger size.
Where did the doggie diaper saga take us. They sit on the shelf where they were left the day they were brought there, un-used. MIL .. "I can't put these damn things on him and take them off, these arthritic hands of mine".
Ruminating on past errors, yes .. indeed. But it's the best predictor I have as to the future .. and I want no part of a future that looks like what has transpired previously.
Let her do the talking.
Arm twisting? " No, I can't possibly do that. You'll need to talk to your brother about how to get that accomplished.".
I firmly believe their mother needs more care than all these potions/meds/procedures and magic thinking. I'm alone in that ... apparently, (sans the fact a doc also advised same, at one point in this, was summarily ignored).
Let's look at most recently, an occurrence. MIL has continued to complain intermittently since that fall she took back at xmas, back/rib pain. She hasn't seen fit to go have it looked at, I haven't hounded. However, .. when I took her in for knee injections I did mention it in that setting to the PA who attended to the injections for her. There, the advice ... "we can write an order for an MRI for you, to take a look at it". MIL, .. turns to me, .. in question, "do I need to do that?, do I really have to do that?". At that point, the PA interjected, .. "We really have no way of determining what's going on there with the discomfort you feel without further investigation, but it's up to you, if you don't want to do it, we can just write the order and put it in your file, and if you change your mind and want to proceed, we'll just go ahead and get it set up, it's up to you".
I seconded that .. when she looked to me for further assurance. "it's up to you".
If SIL is aware this convo transpired, it's her mother that told her, not me. That was on purpose on my part. I don't any longer, .. engage her in the goings on, on this end, and what was said.
First and foremost, . the approach here is that their mom is of sound mind and functional (I dispute that, but I've not been able to get anyone on that page to look at it, inspite of the fact Neurology wanted that looked at closer, that was ignored). So, if your mom is thought to be of sound mind .. then she can allay those details to you .. if she chooses not to do so, her choice. If she forgets it (likely) .. then it won't be mentioned by her, to you SIL.
I purposely neglected to bring that to the table for discussion .. because ... the arm twisting would begin in earnest. I no longer care to be subject to that. If you want your mom attended to, thus and so, then get your azz on the front lines and DO it, is my thinking. I've been shouting that .. and to no avail. Yet, the arm twisting .. as to the magic thinking of some pill/procedure .. etc .. is gonna be the order of the day, .. me subject to argument .. as to what SIL deems should be done.
That's just one recent example of how I handled what was mine to address on this end.
There was a time that I thought there was a "team" mentality to all this .. and we'd all work together in it all. That has been made abundantly clear, is not the case. Look no further than when MIL was to have been carted outta here back in April .. and a decision made on that by MIL and by SIL .. outside of any input whatsoever, .. as to the parties here that have to prop it all up .. no opinion sought, at all. Where's the "team" approach here.
Yes, .. reflect back on when the vein ablation was ordered. That was ordered by the cardio doc, actually. Now I wasn't there, on that appt., that was some of SIL's doing. But I can just imagine the convo went about like this:
SIL: "What can we do about this chronic edema in her legs .. she just can't take that Lasix .. she can't get to the bathroom, that has her up and down and she just can't do it, what can we do".
Doc: "Well we've advised her a number of times that if she can't tolerate the Lasix .. she can certainly try support hose .. and that's something we can look at".
MIL: (lamenting now, been there for that dialogue more times than I can count) .. "Oh I can't do that, these arthritic hands of mine ... I just can't, there's no way that I can do that".
Doc: "We can look at seeing if we can get a home health aide to
If you are going to effect true change ( change in DHs thinking, change in SIL's behavior, change in MILs approach to old age--I know, YOU can't change any of those, but the change in your behavior IS having an effect--and peace for you, then you have to let past errors go and focus on the now.
Yes, DIL has been a pain in the past, trying to micromanage. Let her try that today, with you, MIL and doc all pushing back at her fussing. Just as an example, the vein ablation. What if you'd been in the room with cardio to ask
" doc, will that procedure help mom's edema, or is it a cosmetic procedure?".
Or, for your playbook, going forward, " I can't facilitate any treatments that are not evidence-based. Or those which MIL is not going to commit to or doesn't have the wherewithal to comply with."
"Who is going to transport her to that appointment and followup?".
"How is she going to obtain those foods/treatments/procedures?"
" MIL, can you commit to having PT come to your home 3 times a week?".
This is for future times, not today. As CM says, just be the driver.
But if there is a time MIL comes back to FL, ask hard questions. Calmly.
Just think about this.
Hope today goes well, Dorker. Remember you're just the driver, any questions or comments can go direct to SIL in preparation for the Grand Visit, forget the rest of it because it's not going to make any material difference to anything at this point, and let MIL make the most of your pleasant company.
Avoid stress, avoid disruptions, avoid complications. Quite apart from headaches for you, all of those can trigger not only MIL's gut problems but also her A Fib. What's more important is a quiet life with a little affection thrown in to sweeten it - and those, lucky for her, you're already helping with.
Breathe. Relax.
You are free to bring up YOUR concerns about the idea that MIL might return to FL to live alone after a visit to IL.
Frankly, you'd be a lot more in charge if you let SIL try to run things.
My opinion only, of course. Hive mind, what do you think?