I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
You know that it is only a matter of time before SIL overworks herself into illness again.
Why does she think so little of herself that she puts up with this abuse (and yes, I consider constant sleep deprivation to be a form of abuse)? As long as she hasn't gotten her brother to agree to participate in this self-abuse (and he hasn't and won't), it looks like this circus isn't going to be coming to Florida.
Or will it?
MIL has passed her personality disorder on to the male line.
This will demonstrate good faith of SIL intentions to return to Illinois with MIL if indeed MIL will even go to FL without Poochy. Problem solved.....
and......if that fails because all parties involved will have a thousand excuses as to why this can't or won't happen .....
If MIL gets left alone in FL then APS MUST be called in short order...again...problem solved...
Please don't write me back a book...don't have the time for this SOS story and have only read small bits of it......
Time for the KISS program already......
Your comments about the temperatures being oh, so cold and how miserable she is b/c of it hit a nerve. My mother is also always just freezing, except in the summer when she is so hot and miserable. Year round, her thermostat is set at 85 degrees. I work up a sweat getting mom & walked in the house. She barely moves, so I am sure that's part of the "deal" also, I am half Norwegian and my sibs and I just don't feel the cold. I have coats, but I almost never wear them. Neither do any of my sibs. We tease mother that she has thin English blood, but the truth is, she looks out her front window all day long and if it "looks cold" she''' crank up the thermostat. It could be 90, it could be 30, she "looks" outside and dresses and acts according to her "thinking". Basically, she is housebound, probably leaving her place for less than 10 hours per week.
The waiting is killing you, right? The waffling and indecision...what a nightmare. I think after the post is put to rest, sometime in the future, it should be left up as a reminder to others just how BAD trying to care for some parents "in home" can be.
Your life has been severely impacted, DH's much less so, and SIL's has been utterly consumed by it. How sad. Nobody should live,breather and sleep for another person. Sometimes, for a period of time, yes, it's needed, but not for years and years.
I agree with BlackHole--when MIL finally passes, you watch: SIL will be inconsolable, as if her mother was someone so special she shouldn't ever have had to die. It's gonna be awful. That is one lousy legacy. Living so selfishly so far past your "due date" is not the way to graciously exit this world, and MIL does have options for a much more dignified and selfless way to live. She simply can't take off the crown long enough to see that.
I guess the takeaway from this is that SIL has seen up close and personal what you have been dealing with. (Actually, it's gotten a LOT worse with her care..if you think about it). She respects that now (I hope!)
Oh well---tomorrow is another day. See what that got Scarlett O'Hara, that line of thinking?
Not a happy ending to the movie and not one in life, either.
SIL describing she is now sleeping in what is their middle bedroom .. closer to where MIL sleeps, as opposed to sleeping in her own bed in her bedroom.
Reason, so she can hear MIL if she gets up to go to the bathroom and help her .. (apparently her bladder .. maybe things take a while to .. progress .. when she has to go relieve herself . things don't just happen .. one has to run water .. and think about it .. and sit there .. and sit there and then eventually the bladder empties .. to the degree it's going to do so anyway) . takes a while. So she needs to be up and helping her mom to get to and fro .. if that occurs . and she does. And then the dog .. the dog it seems needs to go out maybe a couple of times a night .. and so she does that so that MIL won't need to.
She said the dog needed to go out at about 1 AM .. and so she was up with that . then MIL up a couple of times for a bathroom stop .. then the dog back up at 5 AM .. and by that time, the snow outside was deeper than his little legs .. so she then had to go put on her snow boots and jacket and grab a shovel and carve a path for him to get out and alleviate himself.
GOOD LORD!!!!!!!!!!!!
I was describing all this to DH .. about my conversation with his sister .. and he said, "WHY IN THE NAME OF GOD are they coming back here . if SIL is having to do all that for her .. she needs to just keep her there .. she doesn't need to be coming back here".
My response: "your mom is so unhappy there .. that's the reason .. she's so unhappy and somehow she thinks . if she's home .. the land of magical fairy dust and unicorns will ensue and she'll be more *well*".
He is just as disgusted as I am.
As I told him: "your mom can't even toilet alone anymore, needs someone to attend to that function, .. can't bathe on her own .. I know for a fact she can't dress on her own anymore .. needs help .. can't take care of her own dog .. she .. the worst in the world . needs to be where there is staff around the clock to help her .. your poor sister .. this is all on her to do. I have no control over whether they do or don't go that path .. but if your sister wants to keep getting up around the clock to help your mom toilet, . to let the dog in and out . that's on her .. ".
DH: "Well when they get back here, I can certainly go spend the weekend over there .. and help and let SIL and B get a break .. if they want .. but I can't help her bathe . she won't want that .. but I'll do what I can to help .. when they get back here .. but SIL should've thought about all this years ago when she said she'd sell her home when she retires and move closer here . and then changed course and decided not to do that .. so now she lives all the way up there, I can't help her .. she's gonna have to be here .. and I'll help her here . .as best I can . but I can't be off all times of the week carting her to docs and running to get this and that whirligig that she always thinks is gonna restore it all .. and all she does .. ".
Whatever. I just listen to it all .. and ponder .. surely this delusional SIL doesn't think it an option any longer that her mom can be left on her own.
I think she did . maybe .. at one time .. delude herself that she'd get her mom up there and breathe for her .. and strengthen her to the point she could deposit her back into her own home .. and depart for her own life. I hope she has seen .. that's not possible. One can only hope.
DH says all the right things . but his past hasn't demonstrated that his words match his deeds. He says that he's gonna let his sister know that under no circumstances . is she to be left again, . on her own. That .. as long as she remains here in FL .. and with her, he'll do what he can here, to help her .. but that she is not to be left to her own .. to live alone. We'll see if he means it.
I told him to prepare for pushback from his his mom . who is gonna refuse to leave ever again.
I got an email yesterday from her (really her only means to communicate with me anymore, sans calling me, which she doesn't seem to do). I was out running some errands and saw her email pop up. Pulled it up and that's what it went into explaining, just simply that they wouldn't be coming on 1/26 .. just want to make sure that the Shingles pain has subsided some .. hasn't yet. And the bladder is working behind having been catheterized.
So I called her .. while I was out running around.
Wanted to get a feel from her, .. if she knows .. she doesn't .. when is it they are targeting to try to come. She doesn't know really. She hopes maybe 1 week later, but will have to see how her mom is doing at that point. Doesn't want to make plane reservations only to have to put a halt to that flight also, as she had to do earlier this month.
All I can think .. though I didn't ask that question .. surely she doesn't think it possible any longer that her mom can be left alone to manage.
She went in to explaining that her mom freezes all the time .. that they are part of this latest weather system moving thru the area .. and their temp for today was predicted to be 2 degrees outside .. and how cold it is there. Lots of snow. Said they have no reason to have to be outside, so they'll just hunker in .. and stay indoors. Said that even so, her mom freezes .. all the time.
How hard it is . that they have turned their furnace up to 74 .. when normally they'd keep it at 70 for themselves and their comfort level. She went on to explain that helping her mom bathe (didn't ask why . I know she was helping her mom when she was catheterized .. to be able to take a sponge bath). Her describing that she just about melts .. she gets so hot she has to strip down herself into her underclothes .. just to bear it .. being in the hot bathroom .. to help her mom bathe .. and it just about melts her .. and her mom freezes, all the time.
I did counter that, "oh that's nothing new, she freezes here, when it's 100 degrees outside, and you have the AC on in her house just to be able to function . she freezes . .generally has on about 3 layers .. her undershirt, her PJ shirt and a sweat jacket ... even when it's hot enough outside to melt metal, that's just her".
About that time, MIL must've made her way to where SIL was on the phone and SIL announced she was talking to Dorker .. and MIL then . you could hear her in the b'ground .. "Did you tell her how bad all this is .. it's just so bad .. tell her how bad it all is".
At that, I did counter .. (she couldn't hear me, it wasn't on speaker phone, but SIL heard me) .. "yes it's so bad .. she's in a climate controlled home .. and a roof over her head and a daughter attending to her every need .. it's all so bad". I couldn't help myself.
I'm quite certain that was aimed specifically at me . the driver of the initiative to get her out of here for hurricane season . which has long since passed. Not my fault that .. SIL didn't choose to get her and take her away from here until hurricane season was .. oh about 3 months into it's season .. and ... since that time MIL has had a myriad of issues that precluded her ability to travel back this way.
If they'd get her . .June 1 ... when hurricane season starts .. and then be back here oh about mid October .. they'd then avoid any danger of hurricane season .. and .. be out of there before harsh winter sets in. Oh but SIL couldn't do that .. she had her son coming with his entourage .. mid end of June and into July . then she had to recoop from that whirlwind .. and a myriad of other "excuses" .. and so she didn't come get her until the end of August. June 1 begins hurricane season.
So anyhoo ... her mom is now someone who has to be assisted to be able to bathe .. among most other ADL's ...
SIL describing that she is now sleeping in the middle room,
SIL is baffling to me. . . OK, I can kind of understand the martyrdom, insisting on providing the 24/7 care or die trying, but taking this whole thing on the road between IL and FL? The laundry situation in FL alone would shut that right down for me. This is a mix of martyrdom/hyperactivity/cluelessness that I just can't wrap my head around. . . Paging Dr. Freud or Dr. Phil or Dr. Someone . . .
Dorker, please do keep us posted as events warrant.
Dnot know for how long. Doesn't sound like a long delay.
Trying to allow more time for Shingles pain to subside as well as allowing more time to make sure the newly un-catheterized bladder is working.
So ... a reprieve from the coming onslaught ... for now.
Dh has set boundaries and Dorker needs to do same. She shouldnt do more than DH is willing to do. At some point, she and he need to have a serious and honest convo about expectations.
Everyone should take a lesson from absent son. He called it early, and accurately.
Which, as we all knew - was that sil would get mil in her home in IL - get her PT, three healthy squares a day, clear up chitapalooza, breath for her and perhaps there would be a new whirlygig or two...
Then - VOILA! MIL restored to able bodied “independence”. Which again, we knew wasn’t gonna happen.
But I’m starting to think that perhaps that never occurred to SIL. Could that be possible? That she’s that - what? “Clueless” Just seems so inadequate.
I think Ive mentioned my old cat here. The fact that this cat had such a small world, spent almost all her time sleeping, expended no energy, no effort... I wondered how long she could live life this way - kinda just existing but with no risks or effort - it was like kitty lived in a suspended bubble.
I compare(d) this to MIL and her suspended existence in her ironed pajamas - at that level of “living” just how long before she trickled out...
It could take a while - all wrapped up in cotton wool as she is.
The thing is - maybe I’m dense - maybe you all have already had this light bulb moment. But I don’t think that it has really occurred to SIL - until now - that suspended animation can go on and on and on...
It was only ever Plan A for sil. Come get mom, make mom stronger, take mom back to FL, return back to life in IL.
Now, whether it’s shock, denial or inability- sil doesn’t have a clue as to a Plan B.
At age 18 and showing signs of being in pain - we had to have our poor old cat put to sleep in November- but I suppose that’s no Plan B for mil...
(did I actually just say that? Sorry!)
What a lousy legacy.
As human dynamics go, the “sap factory” will probably kick in when MIL passes. For a brief spell.
The cliches will wear off quickly.
The remaining truth will be that no one in the inner circle has one good memory of MIL from the last 5-10 years of her life. 😐
As the daughter of a "mild" narcissist--(I thought mother was bad until I started reading your posts!!) I KNOW the mind games they play on you--for life. When you get out and start controlling the relationship--finally-you realize how effed up the whole thing has been from the get go.
MIL will come back. I predict some minor little excursions to NH's will happen and they will all be found "wanting" in some regard. Since SIL has done NOTHING to facilitate MIL's move to one, it's not going to happen. So--how long before MIL needs a trip to the ER, or a dogie crisis occurs? A day? Two? How in the h3ll is she supposed to do laundry? Toilet herself? Begin to even TRY to do the ADLS that "healthy" people can do? Take care of poochy?
Dh has sat back and ignored this pretty well. I admire that tenacity. (I'm being snarky) My Dh is the same.
Well--the 26th is next Sat., and if I were you, I wouldn't do a single thing to facilitate them getting back into the house. You step in and next thing you know, you'll be running the show, or worse yet, having DH riding you to help.
Recently I had a run in with my MIL. She said some awful stuff to my SIL and thought I couldn't hear. DH can't, so he was just playing on his phone as his mother kind of starts in on me. SIL was appalled and kept saying "Mother, hush up!"
After the "visit" DH and I left. I was crying--just done with it all (plus I was getting sick)....he said I was being a baby and to grow up. I asked him to call SIL and ask her what MIL had said in my hearing--so he did and she stood by him and stuck up for ME. He was shocked, b/c he has NEVER believed that his mother was capable of this kind of put downs. After this conversation, I looked at him and said "I'm DONE!!!!!!!!!! I will NEVER and I mean NEVER speak to your mother again. I also will do everything in my power to never have to even be around her again. I cause her so much grief and pain and she hates me so dearly...44 years is enough." He's accepted that and hasn't brought it up again.
I do not hate this woman. I feel for her, but she has a way of just ruining relationships--and everything is about HER. Just like your MIL.
Difference is, my SIL doesn't live and breathe for her mother, but she does fuss her a lot. DH could not care less.
I don't know what will happen and neither do you, but you have a pretty good idea. It's all going to fall apart by Feb 1st and MIL will be in a hospital or NH against her will.
There's always that anonymous call to APS about an elder in danger. That alone, if followed through will probably cause her to be hauled out kicking and screaming from her home.
Anyway you look at it, this is sad. And a mighty good "DO NOT DO THIS" warning.
It's all so confounding to me.
I can so clearly see what others seem blind to.
As Rainmom put it .. she's gonna have one hand on her packed suitcase waiting for her husband's next hangnail .. and off she'll "need to go" to attend to him and his maladies.
Where does that leave MIL?
MIL who, I am quite certain .. once planted back into her home .. will dig in her heels and refuse to E-V-E-R entertain any further notion of exiting her home E-V-E-R again .. even for the sake of helping SIL to attend to her husband.
And .. btw .. MIL doesn't move on a dime ..
SIL gets a call that her husband has "x" malady and she feels she needs to be on the next plane outta here .. back to IL to attend to him .. MIL doesn't move that way.
First there is the dog and the need to make sure the ESA paperwork is in order, .. then there is the forwarding the mail .. to IL .. and .. all that will be entailed in getting MIL towed along with her, so she can hop on that plane back to IL to attend to her husband.
Nope .. nobody seems to want to look at that eventuality.
You even propose it to her .. and it gets met with: "I can't think about what happens tomorrow ...........".
It's all so infuriating .. absolutely infuriating.
And at the bottom of it all, at the root of it all .. is an old frail woman that is calling the shots and given the latitude to do so. An old frail woman that is so absolutely dependent upon the help of others as to her very existence ..
And so she calls the shots .. that she wants to be in her own home.
And no one seems willing/able to address the fact that "being in her own home" is going to require that SIL give up her life ... until she cannot .. and has to rush back to IL .. and then what?
Nobody wants to look at that.
No, I firmly believe it, I see it coming .. even if there is no calamity on her husband's part .. and the next several months sail along without incident .. time to go back to IL . MIL will still dig in firmly and refuse to go ..
SIL .. who will not argue and counter and persuade .. will then try to "sell it" that she will manage, rather than argue/persuade, demand, etc. She will then try to "Sell it" .. that she can manage .. and there you'll have it.
DH who hasn't shown a propensity in all this either, to be the "bad guy" the one lone voice in it all, in opposition to popular opinion . will "buy what she's selling" .. and off SIL will go .. and then the wars under this roof will begin when MIL is experiencing her next calamity and it'll be back to "FOR CHRISSAKES DORKER" ..
So clear to me what needs to happen .. but I am powerless to even voice any of it, does no good . and it certainly doesn't spur any actionable, demonstrative moves on any of their parts.
Nope just magical thinking and more magical thinking, the order of the day.
She was on the topic of how stressful this has all been for MIL .. who didn't want to be there, didn't even want to entertain any notion of having to be hauled there .. and hasn't really come around to resigning herself to this plight .. it's all been so stressful for her, . .she doesn't want to be there, wants to be in her home.
SIL: "It's all been really pretty taxing to her, .. you know .. she didn't want to do this to begin with .. and of course, since she got here it's been one thing after another as to all the calamities and health issues .. and ya know . this Shingles .. who knows .. maybe that too .. part of why she even got Shingles, .. the strife and stress of all this .. who can say. I know it sure didn't go *how I wanted it to go* .. she had that PT and she says it really didn't prove all that helpful. It just hasn't gone, at all, the way I kinda wanted it to go .. I figured we'd get her some PT and get her stronger and maybe she'd do a little better .. but ya know she's had more than her share of health calamities here .. and she says that PT she got .. it didn't really help that much".
I really have to just keep my distance from too much communication with her .. because so much of her magical thinking and the next big whirligig .. and so forth sends me into orbit ..
To pick apart the above ..
If I were on the same page I used to be on, .. and would offer suggestion and/or opinion .. I'd of told her .. "Ya know, I don't know what planet you've been on .. that you don't see ... what has been said to you countless times .. she was experiencing those same health calamities/maladies here .. only no one in attendance to go get the next supposed whirligig that's gonna bring about restoration of health and wellness .. she's had how many bouts of PT .. that she says each time, don't prove all that helpful .. why bother. She never wanted to entertain any notion of coming here and it's all been so stressful for her. Maybe you would ALL do better to help her to understand that her home .. is not the magical land of milk and honey . and she was still experiencing these same things there .. and that it's not her home that is gonna bring about the unicorns and fairy dust .. help her to understand that she is now at a point in her life that this is her plight .. and she will need to be helped .. and that's gonna have to be where YOU can help her, in your home, or .. around the clock staff .. rather than rushing off for the next whirligig . or whatever it is, or promises of return to her own home".
I wanted to say that to SIL. But of course, I no longer do. I just smile and nod.
But seriously.....!!!!.....what frickin planet is she on.
So now I guess the next big thing is to return her to her home .. and that's gonna then bring about the trumpets playing and the rainbows and unicorns and fairy dust ..
Only it won't .. so then it'll be the next whirligig .. the next magical fix .. whatever.
Just .. delusional .. I don't know.
To answer Emily's point. DH too thinks it confounding they'd be returning to FL and why. So he asked his sister why.
Response: "oh she so hates it here, it's too cold .. she just .. she didn't even wanna be here to begin with and it's been one big catastrophe after another since she got here .. she just wants to be in her home, her things .. where she's more comfortable. As many accommodations as I've made here, grab bars on the walls .. and so forth .. it's still .. not home .. it's not as set up as her home is for her .. she still has to get down that one step to get into the den .. where we all seem to congregate .. and that's hard for her .. she still has to get down that one step in the garage to get into the car .. (same as at her house, but who wants to look at reality).
I think Poochy is going to be the big sticking point to placing MIL in a facility in FL. SIL will take Poochy back to IL with her; that will not be acceptable to MIL. She will NOT agree to go to any AL (or, more likely, NH).
I just don't think SIL will leave MIL in FL in her own home, though. She knows how much care MIL requires. And even with all of her plate-spinning-hamster wheel-running, MIL is NOT in good health. Does SIL think she can force her brother to take over? I don't think she does.
I think SIL is planning to come to FL to give her mother her heart's desire -- to return to FL. I do think SIL is thinking along the lines that maybe she can convince her mother to go to AL after they tour some places in FL. Of course in the back of her mind, she knows this will be a big fight, but Scarlett O'SIL likes the "maybe tomorrow" aspect of it all. It's the only way it will make sense to her.
Its “one day at a time... and just that one other day when we catch the flight back to the Land of Milk and Honey - where ALL THINGS are possible”.
Oh, for effs sake!!!
And - I hate to say it... but I see a dump and run in the not too distant future. Not that sil is out right planning for that. But you can bet she’s gonna be sitting with one hand on her suitcase - waiting for BILs first hangnail.
Then it it will be a guilt free “Well, what am I supposed to do? BIL needs me there. Brother - you’re just
going to have to step up and manage”.
I think we all know how things will go from there.
Yep. I see a big ‘ole dark storm cloud a-brewin’. And it’s gonna rain chit down on everyone.
Hmmm - well apparently she IS thinking about tomorrow by the very act of planning the flights and doggie moving and trip back to Florida. That is NOT just getting through each day. In fact, the whole idea of all the prep and life disruption she is planning sounds grueling and exhausting to me! She has something in the back of her mind, whether it be dumping and running, actually pursuing an AL placement, or the fantasy of emergency placement by default (thus alleviating her of guilt and responsibility by lack of choice.)
Someone (probably DH) needs to ask her a simple question, which is WHY are you all coming back to Florida at all? The answer will possibly be to look for AL living arrangements in Florida. But even that idea should be thoroughly discussed and OK'd by DH first, as he WILL become the goto person in Florida. (hopefully you have made this clear to DH, Dorker)
My guess is that when SIL leaves, DH will need to get emergency guardianship for his mother and have her placed with the assistance of FL's adult protective Services social workers. Dorker, it might be best for you to be at Cherry Grove out of MIL's reach, but with a phone to be able to call your FL local Adult Protective Services contact to report a senior who could be in immediate danger. I really feel that the only way anything is going to move forward is for a placement to be forced on the family by outsiders. It would be the kind thing for you to report MIL being left alone in her condition, so I would not hesitate to be the bad guy and actually make a non-anonymous report. "I was worried about MIL since DH said she had not answered the phone last night but he couldn't get around until after work." Honesty is something you are really good at.
I find it all so confounding though. I mean .. just the suggestion that she may have her own health crises that directs things towards MIL and a placement. What happens in the interim? So MIL just flounders around on her own, and SIL rendered unable to help her at all, due to her own health malady?
Why not .. it makes better sense to me, . .to look at the inevitable that could force the hand of all this and plan accordingly.
I don't talk to SIL all that frequently anymore. In fact, the only way she and I communicate .. is if I call there . which is rare .. and if she emails me, less rare, but even that isn't all that frequent.
What little I do communicate with her, . she does lament the burden all this is .. and how grueling it all is .. (I agree, . she's preaching to the choir, .. I don't dispute that fact).
I no longer suggest .. "yes I know it is, .. maybe you should be considering other options .. such as placement for your mom". I just nod appropriately and agree with her. I had suggested .. in the past .. no longer do so .. "why don't you enlist your daughter to come for an afternoon periodically .. so that you and B can head out for some R&R .. if only for an afternoon". That got met with, more than once, .. oh so busy that M is .. and she can't because of this or that reason (all a bunch of b'chit if you ask MO). I no longer suggest that. I just smile and nod and agree appropriately.
I do find it though, absolutely infuriating .. all of it.
I liken the whole thing to the story from across the street from us .. and that will be the direction this all takes in the end.
The old woman . who was once spry and did all her own yard work . daily you'd see her out pruning roses and mowing her own lawn .. whatever. She finally got old and infirm . and had 3 daughters, one son. 3 of those daughters live local.
One of the daughters would not hear of it that her mom should be placed. The other two disagreed with that approach.
Daughter #1 took her into her own home to care for her.
Before all was said and done, the mother was all but catatonic . bedridden .. (strokes....???....I don't really know) .. didn't know who she was, where she was, .. unable to feed herself and anything else, and this specific daughter her c'taker . and bitter and resentful that the siblings left it all to her, and wouldn't come and help.
That's where this is going to go.
SIL chooses this path .. and I guess because DH .. isn't able to .. in some of it .. be the attendee to it all . and refuses to do so .. in some cases .. and because I don't ascribe to this path .. I won't .. and we have the estranged brother . .and for all he knows MIL passed years ago . he could care less ..
SIL will grow resentful and bitter being the only one to take this on.
That's my prediction.
Either that or she does waltz off again, .. to the selling of .. "she'll be fine now .....".
In which case, let the circle of life begin anew ... where DH tries to bully me into his mom's care .. and causes friction under our roof .. all because the two of them REFUSE to address it by any other means than what the mom prefers .. to stay firmly entrenched, dug in, in her own home. PERIOD.
She'll be the belle of the ball and will say "this was such a good idea; why didn't any of you suggest this to me YEARS ago?".
I can't change life-long patterns in these folks. I guess at one time I was foolish enough to think my thoughts and opinions in it all, counted for something. Particularly/specifically .. because they were opinions/thoughts that were being voiced by someone doing the heavy lifting in it all. Found out otherwise .. the hard way.
Guestshop is absolutely correct. SIL hasn't done of the leg work to make any determination of how placement would go, the path forward. As she would put it, to bring it up .. it brings about so much despair in mother, so much sadness and angst.
Ooookay then ..
And my suggestions that maybe some support group/counseling .. might help, that too falls flat.
Ooookay then.
Guestshop is right. SIL worked diligently to get things routed to a Rehab stint at the last hospitalization for MIL . .rather than discharge to her home. There, .. having arrived at the site .. and seeing there, .. on site .. variations of folks ailing . some slumped over in wheelchairs .. maybe even having lost any will to even pick up their heads .. and other variations of sad states of folks .. she couldn't "bear" to leave her mom there, and turned course, took her home.
How is she ever gonna be able to walk into what would be a site/facility anywhere, that will be, essentially a Medicaid setting .. one in which, .. for the most part, .. even in the best of all scenarios, will find her sharing a room more than likely .. and not a comfy posh room but a room .. with a bed .. and if she's lucky a bathroom she shares with only one other soul, ..
That will be wholly unsatisfactory to either of them.
So fine then ....
I guess if it were me, I'd have a need to look down the road at "tomorrow" and figure out for myself, .. how am I going to manage my own life and the care of my ailing/frail/aged mother and ever increasing need, .. and yet also be helpful and aid my husband and his maladies .. how will I do so .. let me plot that out.
Instead you get .. "I can't think about what happens tomorrow". Ooookay then!
It truly does come down to .. a difference in approaches.
My approach .. I would indeed be getting a support group attendance for myself, to come to terms with all that's on my horizon . .I would be getting MIL some counseling to try to improve her grasp of the horizon that's coming .. if that's possible, .. all while working an angle to find the best possible setting .. albeit a Medicaid one .. but I'd be working that angle . and onward we'd go.
SIL .. she can't bear that .. she just can't bear to see her mom spend what are her last days (years, who knows) .. in *sadness/despair* that the above brings about .. and thus .. she can only think about today and getting through today .. and what comes tomorrow .. she'll worry about that another day .. she can only, as she puts it .. "I can .. as long as I can do it . .and who knows when that comes .. that's all I can do .. is try to take this on . .and do the best I can to be her caretaker".
Very much a difference in approaches. Very very much so.
It's "her mom" ... and so .. she gets more of a voice in it all. Understandably/justifiably so. What she doesn't get .. is my participation in that which I don't any longer abide by.
So do it yourself then.
An incredible burden she is shouldering .. I'm aware of that. All too aware.
She can choose to do otherwise .. she just doesn't choose to do so. So be it.
But don't look in my direction any longer to prop up that which I don't support, .. all so you can go home to your life .. and live it the way you wish to .. and your mom and her choices then fall into my lap to manage. Doesn't work that way any longer. Her needs have grown far greater than I care to step to meet.
First thing that came to mind when I read that was Scarlett O'Hara.
"I'll think about that tomorrow. Tomorrow IS another day."
SIL even agreed that it's best I step away .. under the guise (her assessment) .. that she feels .. kind of .. a pressure/stress in my involvement in it all, .. to have to answer to me .. and as she put it, .. "this is all stressful enough just living it .. and you and I differ in the approach to it all, .. she's my mom . and I want to .. as best I can .. as long as I can do it .. until I can't do it anymore, .. I want her to be as happy as she can be .. and even contemplating placing her .. brings about in her, too much despair and unhappiness .. so .. the best I know to do is to do this .. at least .. as long as I can .. and until I just can't do it anymore .. "
She went on to say in that conversation that she can't do things the way I would have her do them and I countered, .. and I can't do things the way you would have them done .. if you want her cared for in the manner that you're doing, then you need to be the one to do it ..
I WOULD NOT .. be doing what she's doing .. carting her back to FL. And with the promise that . yes I know you don't wanna do it .. but you will be back on a plane in a few months and going back to IL .. and then back on a plane a few months from that .. and going back to FL.
I WOULD NOT be doing that. She has a husband that has his own health concerns and for varying reasons .. also require her presence and attendance, at times to his matters. I would be making MIL understand that FL .. is gonna be off the radar .. and her home will now be in IL .. and likely in an AL or facility .. period ... that her needs have become such that she cannot any longer attain any kind of independent living .. at all, period .. not safely .. and so .. she is going to have to understand that going back to FL is no longer an option .. that my life also has to be considered in all of this .. and how I manage all that I need to manage in my world".
I wouldn't be doing it this way.
But I have voiced all this .. and it all falls flat ...
In the end, . it's not my mom .. and my opinions don't matter.
Thus ... my participation also .. won't be a part of it all.
Sadly .. if I had any iron-clad guarantee (there is none) that they mean it, .. that SIL will be her c'giver .. 24/7, 365 .. and that will sometimes be in FL and sometimes be in IL .. but under no circumstances is she going to be left to fend for herself .. ever again .. under any circumstance .. I think I would do things like ..SIL here .. in town .. staying with her .. maybe I'd be the one to pick her up and cart her to one of her numerous doc visits .. and maybe stop and have lunch out .. and then bring her back to SIL. I would .. participate .. if I had that kinda iron clad guarantee.
But with these folks . you give an inch . they take a mile.
Then it becomes .. "Well Dorker you took her the last two times to the doc .. I'm gonna go on home to IL .. she has a doc appt next week .. and then the week after, so just cart her to those too . .and she'll be fine .. she'll manage".
That's what it becomes in the end, . gave an inch . now you want to take a mile.
SIL did mention they'd be looking at and visiting some AL sites here .. or whatever. I don't intend to be any part of that ...
What I find suitable . and a workable site .. they'd likely argue as not suitable and I don't care to get into that arena either. You guys go searching out and talking to the various sites .. and whatever you find or don't .. will not have my input weighing in, to then have the frustrations of them finding it not suitable and off we go to another 100 sites for them to then argue the finer points of each.
Personally .. I don't think her fit any longer for AL .. I think she's more NH material at this point .. but .. my thoughts/opinions .. don't matter. Thus I just smile and nod .. and practice my "well that's nice, I hope that works out for you".
It frustrates and confounds me to the ends of the earth, the whole thing.
I have voiced my questions and my misgivings about it all, .. all for naught. I'm practicing my "well that's nice, hope that works out for you", rather than the questions/suggestions that used to be my approach.
I mean you hear about people not wanting to move away and it's generally because of their engagement in, i.e. ... maybe their church group .. and friends there, or maybe their garden club that they've attended for eons .. or their neighborhood friends .. or .. whatever. With MIL . there's none of that .. she no longer even has family here, other than her son (DH) and his family here locally. Her friends from yester-year have all passed on.
I ask that question and it's met with what I think of as a bunch of hooey:
"Oh FL is where she spent her whole life, she doesn't want to be in IL . it's too cold here .. the *culture* is different here, with mid-westerners vs southerners".
I'm over here like, "WTH? I mean we aren't talking a culture difference of the USA vs some other country, just .. WTH?"
I'm over here like "WTH .. it's cold there, she's in a climate controlled home for God's sake .. it's not like you've thrown her out into a snowbank outside and told her to rough it .. she's in a home that has heat ... WTH ... she has to go outside, when ..??.....for doc appts, and that entails getting into the car from the confines of an enclosed garage .. not like she's having to step through ice and snow to get into a car that is likely already cranked and heated .. jeeze .. just WTH, .. and I know that SIL drops her at the door of whatever establishment they are to go to .. so again .. not like she's having to trudge thru a parking lot of ice and snow, just .. whatever .. WTH"
No, .. my prediction is that they are returning to FL .. where MIL wants to be, where she can then dig in her heels and refuse any further transfer back to IL and SIL's care 24/7 .. and she will absolutely steadfastly refuse to go again, ever .. E-V-E-R .......... and SIL will try to "sell it" that she's fine to manage on her own.
SIL cannot stay here indefinitely . .she cannot .. and won't.
Nor will SIL (apparently) insist that her mother .. "STAY" in IL . with her there. She won't.
In fact, .. as I posed to DH at one point .. "Okay well this is the plan I suppose .. if you wanna call it that .. so SIL says .. that she'll just do this as long as she can .. til she can't do it anymore, .. MIL in her care, and that means trudging back and forth every few months between IL and FL .. MIL is too old and frail for all that .. but whatever .. that's their plan and they're sticking to it, I guess. So what happens when SIL is down here in FL .. and caring for your mom, per your mom's "DEMANDS" that she wants to be in FL ... not in IL .. then her husband B has some crises with his own health . which is also kinda tenuous .. and now she needs to be on a plane to get back to IL to attend to her husband . what happens to MIL then ... she gonna go along for the ride .. or is SIL gonna leave her here, selling it that she's fine to manage on her own .. ".
You pose that scenario to SIL .. and I did .. when she gave me the approximate 15 mins of her time .. to hear me .. after .. all the resistance to "hearing me" for forever .. and her answer is, "I can't really think about tomorrow, it's all I can do to get thru each day .. this is all really pretty stressful and grueling .. all I know is that I just get up each day and take it as it comes .. and I can't even think about what tomorrow brings or the what if's in it all".
That's her answer.
Which was met by me, and a return volley of, "Well at least we're all clear that I am stepping out of any c'giving role with her .. I will visit her .. whatever, . but looking after her and her ailments and carting her and/or her dog and their needs to docs and so forth . I'm stepping away from all that".
I made that clear.
Dorker, if I were you I'd be eyeing a cruise that departs on the 25th, then.
Eyeing this flight with what degree of confidence, did she say..? And then..? Does the plan even have a letter?
I will be flabbergasted if SIL's intent is to eventually leave FL and leave MIL to her own devices in her home. And I think she knows that her brother and Dorker can/won't be the caregivers for MIL.