My mom said we passed 2 months ago. She had a p and a account which I did $878 in it. We thought that money would come to us as we owe a little bit more money on her funeral. She owed the nursing home $1,200 and they took that PNA money towards the payment. Is this legal I live in New Jersey
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Can anyone answer a question?
The thought of going to SS and waiting I have no patience for !
And a 45 minute wait on the phone at that !!
How can I as POA cash a check made out to my mom ? Will I need to open an account at the bank I don't want to hurt my mothers Medicaid benefits!!
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Kittycatzgt

What does the contract/agreement your mom or you signed about this? There should be a section about NH trust accounts.

If you would do this, I believe your name would need to be listed somewhere on the account, and if you don't want to manage it, a third party would then be named.
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Can anyone answer this question! I want to put my mothers trust account into a savings account! Can I do that without being representative payee ???
Also everything is paid for she pays for no cable etc !!
Can I do all this myself ? The nursing home has taken over $100 on one day stating mother bought stuff but they NEVER gave me any receipts!!
Please answer this! It's got me totally upset 😞
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The nursing home my mother is n gets her social security checks and what is left over goes into a trust account! I suspect they are taking money from her trust ! I've called cooperate office and had them freeze her account till I decide what to do ? Can i put her trust account money into a savings account from bank ?
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Everything is paid for from the NH - I have frozen my moms trust account so nobody can touch and my mom knows about it ! Do I need to be representative payee for taking care of mothers S/S etc
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Kitty - I'm assuming that your family member is in a NH and on Medicaid with her SS check going directly to the NH and her personal needs amount placed into a trust account at the NH. If so, the $ in the personal needs trust account can be used by the NH to pay for monthly costs that your family member incurs that are not covered by Medicaid. Often there are phone or cable charges deducted from the trust account. It can also be used to pay for beauty shoppe visits or mom "buys" things from the on-site "store" (most often this will be like she buys socks, shampoo, candy). So think if any of these are being done as it is acceptable for the NH to debit the trust account for this. Also the trust account if they are on Medicaid cannot go over whatever asset limit is for Medicaid. The NH knows that if its over 2K, they will be made ineligible for Medicaid so the NH will go and do a big spend down to buy a wheelchair or walker to get the trust $ down. IF you read back to the first posts on this ? that is what happened with one poster…… A NH should send whomever is the DPOA a statement every 3 or 4 months on the status of the trust account. My mom's first NH didn't ever but mom's 2nd and eons better NH did and every 90 days. You can if DPOA go to the business office to get a copy of the trust account. I'd suggest you do that first before even trying to deal with SSA as your elder is unlikely to personally go to the SSA to get a change done in their account that will be needed.
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How do I become representative payee !
I think the nursing home is taking money from her trust account and I have proof
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If there is an outstanding balance at the NH when a resident passes away, can the money in the trust account be held by the NH to pay on that balance?
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Repete- so you are now going to be paying the nh directly for mom, so her checks are no longer going to nh, right? If so be aware of a couple of things that could be an issue (I pay my moms Medicaid required co pay from her checking acct):
-If you are now writing the checks to pay your moms required co pay to the NH, they may have it within her admission contact on when it is due and if past that a fee. so carefully read the admission contract. If its due by the 6th of the month and mom does not get paid till the 15th, there is going to be a late fee assessed on her account. You -not mom - will have to pay this as you took on the responsibility to be the accountant.
- you need to make sure you buy things for mom from that monthly PNA. You may need to have detailed receipts that the check for $75.00 written to cash has a matching $75 receipt for mom stuff from target. Understand? State can require detailed accountability.
- does your state do an annual renewal & review? My moms does (TX) and I get a renewal letter with a 19 page form which must be submitted within 14 days of the letter date. In addition to the written details in the form, I have to submit her current bank statement AND 3 months prior AND all real property documents (like tax statement on her empty house) and burial /FH policies. Yes, all these were initially submitted with her application back in 2011 but has to be resubmitted annually. If I don't mom can be either suspended from Medicaid or removed. You really don't want to have this be a problem.

About your saying "no contingency for a mom to help her sons" well if they are on Medicaid absolutely NO $ can be used on anything but her care or her needs. State can ask for a ledger with documentation as to the penny where you spent her allowance. (I have a stack of receipts for the past 4 years!) Mom just can't give you any $, no for gas for going to see her or for taking her out to lunch. you may find that due to your changing the co-payment /SOC situation you are going to be scrutinized by Medicaid- fair warning, so document all.

I think the NH did the simplest thing to be able to keep your mom there and no issues for Medicaid - they did a single easy spend down = expensive wheelchair. To me this is a sign of a better NH. They easily could have let her be made ineligible and then you or your brother would be on the hook for months of private pay ($5k at least a month). But they didn't, they want it all to continue to work. they like your mom & your moms care needs are not taxing their abilities. But if you start to pose a problem, they can easily find a reason to send you the 30 Day Notice letter that mom needs to be moved. You probably don't want to go there.
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All of these articles are good & since I have closed the trust fund completely, after the new social worker told me that the old worker had to spend down so she would not be revoked from the facility, which is BS since I had an ongoing petition & they new that, it boils down to since my brother & I are having some medical issues & the law does have a contingency for allowing us some of the $$$ as a mother helping her sons, which I guess they thought that was not going to happen, which is probably why the TV's/DVD players/MP3 players ect.. just disappeared every time they moved her to another room. Then when I questioned it, got told do not know where it went, it's not on the inventory list??? pretty convenient. Just like the first 3 years log of when I picked her up every weekend & brought her home until she could now longer either not tell us when she needed to use the rest room & my wife had to clean her up & do laundry so she was clothed upon return or when she was unable to physically get in & out of the car. Which was a very sad day for me. She has been there now for 8 years?? in the last 3 years I have lost my Dad & Daughter which makes it extremely hard to see her (I do not even think she knows me?) & I myself am now under Doctors care with close monitoring for the meds I'm on. Time to move on & I guess just have to wait & see if here wheelchair is there or being used as community property, then I guess it will be time for a formal written complaint to the Health Board??? it just sucks you can not trust anyone anymore!!!
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Thank you, I know this though, my concern is that I thought they had to get an ok from me before the just spend $5000 for a wheel chair, & since she is not coherent who knows where it will end up & who will use it, because I can't be there 24/7. And conveniently the old social worker no longer works there so I am dealing with a new one. I know she needs stuff, but so many things have just disappeared over the years & pretty much these employees are just there to fulfill requirements to further their career. But I thought they had to consult me first & they were well aware of me application to become the payee. Smells fishy!!!
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Medicare is NOT the issue. But based on what your posted, Medicaid is, I'll bet. Medicaid allows for a set amount for them to have as an asset. Most states have this at 2K, so if you let their PNA build up each month and it goes over the 2K maximum, it is a problem and will cause mom to be canceled by Medicaid as she is over the allowed asset amount. So for my mom @ $ 60 a month, then if I did nothing - took no funds out - then after 34 months mom would be over her asset limit and kicked off Medicaid. She would need to reapply…….not good.

So I'm guessing mom is on Medicaid and her state's max is $ 1,400? You need to find out the exact amount of her monthly allowance and asset limit, so that this doesn't happen again. ALso the NH should have send whomever is mom's contact a statement as to the PNA. My mom;s NH does this every 90 days and it comes right about the same time as mom's every 90 days care plan meeting.

NH should provide an accounting of where the $ went to. You know some places have the ladies on a once a week hairdresser @ $ 15 a set, so that takes care of the $ 60 a month.If they went and spent all the fund to be able to have mom stay on Medicaid, actually that is good. Really you do not want to have to have mom removed as eligible for Medicaid and you have to go and put in a new application and with all that documentation for her. Realize that if she goes off Medicaid, the NH will have to have someone (you) private pay for her care till she is approved for Medicaid again. Medicaid - at least for my mom - took 5 1/2 months to be processed. It could be a lot of $$ that you have to front if you had to.

My gut feeling is that there is no skullduggery by the facility, just they had to do something and like NOW to keep her on Medicaid.

Geez I hope she wasn't suspended for Medicaid….you know at NH running 5K a month, that could be where the funds went.

Go to the business office to see exactly what's what. Good luck.
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Very good, but I have a question, My mom is in a home & I was informed in November she had $6200.00 in her account & they would not give it to me, I am the one who set up the account 7-8 years ago & I was angry that the .... would not give it to me. I immediately stated a case & became her payee. Now when I call to have the money released it's only $1400. They said they had to spend it down so medicare would not kick her out, 1st is that even legal & 2nd since I had started the procedure to become payee, should that not have been my decision?
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Nice article! One thing I have found surprising is that often family do NOT even realize that their parent or elder in the NH has each month a "personal needs allowance" of $ 35 - $ 90 and it is placed in a trust account @ the NH. They hear that all of mom's $ is their co-pay required by Medicaid and have the NH get their SS check &/or their retirement sent directly to the NH. SInce they never deal with the money, they are often unaware that each month the trust is building by their personal needs allowance. My mom's PNA is $ 60 a month and so that is a good bit ($ 720.00 annually) to just be overlooked.

In looking @ NH for my mom, almost all of them said something like …"we find it is simpler, easier, more efficient for family to have the elder's monthly income sent directly to the NH". One NH told me that if I were to write the check for my mom's SOC rather than have mom SS & retirement sent to them, that I would need to have 1 month's average stay paid in advance. Total b.s.

I do think there is a bit of planned scheming going on with the PNA & the trust fund. Like the NH's in which all rooms are charged a "cable fee" or " in room phone fee" which runs 50% or so of the PNA. And there is no easy opt-out on the fees as the room is wired for cable or has a phone mounted on the wall in the room.

One good test on a NH is to ask how family can access the trust account and then ask to see the ledger for this. If it can really only be done easily during the weekday by going to the business office, then that is not very user friendly for family.
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